motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 47 minutes ago, Highmark said: I completely applaud naturally rising wages and just one of the reasons I'm such an advocate on controlling all immigration not just illegal. What we are experiencing here is not natural market forces. A overly exaggerated pandemic that with excessive govt handouts has more to do with people not going back to work than some awakening on wages. At what point will portions of society ever be happy with what they are being paid? You honestly think $15.00/hr tied to inflation will suddenly make all those able but not willing to work do so or will they simply keep asking for more? You think a society without rewards for hard work could ever dream of accomplishing what America has today? If ever this "revolution" comes about you so badly desire I don't think the results will be what you think. Never in history has it and it will lead to far greater and more widespread poverty than we have now. You seem to constantly misunderstand that everyone wants all to prosper and succeed....we just disagree on the way to achieve it for the most people. 40 years of stagnant wages was not a natural market force effect either. Manipulation of the economy cannot be undone without further manipulation to correct the massive gap they created. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer254 Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 36 minutes ago, Highmark said: Or for sure that is a part of the left or his side's thinking. I remember a time my liberal democrat MIL talking about the wealthy saying to me in a rhetorical tone "nobody needs that much do they" and I simply replied "well how many would have nothing or less if some didn't want more and worked their ass off to get it." She really didn't have a response. To quote the Incredibles “When everyone is super, no one will be.” “Everyone is special, Dash”. Dash retorts back to her, “Which is another way of saying that no one is.” It is the never ending plight of the perpetually lazy. Blame capitalism, or anything as to why you are not taking full advantage while professing your knowledge of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 Also, there is nothing natural about market forces. They are all manipulations. The economy is a social construct. Money is a social construct. We could dismantle this all tomorrow and build a better system if we wanted to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 Just now, motonoggin said: Also, there is nothing natural about market forces. They are all manipulations. The economy is a social construct. Money is a social construct. We could dismantle this all tomorrow and build a better system if we wanted to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 9, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, Mainecat said: Just about the time a one earner household went away. Of course lifestyle changes in that timeframe didn't occur either. 40 years ago people were happy with their simple home, bills that only were a mortgage, maybe a car or two, utilities and maybe a cable bill. One or 2 TV's couple land line phones and jump in the car for family vaca. I think you would be surprised how little you could live today with that simple of life. Look at what many families have or should I say want now. You can't look at the past vs present income needs without looking at other changes. Edited June 10, 2021 by Highmark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 9, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, motonoggin said: Also, there is nothing natural about market forces. They are all manipulations. The economy is a social construct. Money is a social construct. We could dismantle this all tomorrow and build a better system if we wanted to. You giving up the boat and your share of the family farm? You give me 100 people equally educated and take everything away from them and give them all $250K and in a matter of years or less and for the most part the same people who were rich will be rich and the same people who were MC will be MC and the same people who were poverty level will be poverty level. My point is its not just "the system." Its work ethic, its ability to conserve, its natural intelligence etc..... Edited June 9, 2021 by Highmark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer254 Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, Highmark said: You giving up the boat and your share of the family farm? You give me 100 people and take everything away from them and give them all $250K and in a matter of years or less and for the most part the same people who were rich will be rich and the same people who were MC will be MC and the same people who were poverty level will be poverty level. Bingo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 9, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, racer254 said: Bingo. They want equal outcome for everyone but themselves.....the people making up the rules. Edited June 9, 2021 by Highmark 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s pump Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 4 hours ago, Snake said: Keith worked under a master plumber, got his own license. Within 5 years he has opened his own shop and is turning down work left and right. Making serious bank. That's motivation. He's a good boy. 4 hours ago, Snake said: So that's how you felt about the famous brother in law or whatever? He should have sent you packing earlier.... what a determent to any business. It's hard to believe he is serious. but we know better. 1 hour ago, Zambroski said: This graphic is incorrect though and that’s been shown to you dozens of times. ”Strife of an entry worker”??? I’ll try not to laugh at this statement and just ask, what do you consider an “entry level worker”? His bait is weak today......maybe try shiners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 9, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 Remind me again what the left likes to say to the pipeline, coal and energy industries regarding losing their jobs? Find another one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinker Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 And here I thought no one should get a wage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 1 hour ago, motonoggin said: 40 years of stagnant wages was not a natural market force effect either. Manipulation of the economy cannot be undone without further manipulation to correct the massive gap they created. Americans standard of living has never been better- quit yer bitchin 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roosting Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 Just wait for the effects of the open border has on stagnating wages.............................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 9, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 11 minutes ago, Roosting said: Just wait for the effects of the open border has on stagnating wages.............................. Huh? The 22-30 million people here illegally already have had ZERO impact on labor supply because obviously they only do jobs American's don't want so it don't account in S&D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voodoo Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 10 hours ago, Skidooski said: One good thing about the pandemic is that it's made something like that closer to being reality. I've been working from home for almost a year and a half now and If I knew for certain it would be permanent I'd move north in a heart beat Lol, y'er in Michigan...how far North can you go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 2 hours ago, Angry ginger said: Americans standard of living has never been better- quit yer bitchin It's an illusion all financed by debt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 Once again many of you are making the emotional merit-based argument as to why certain workers don't deserve better wages. This is simply about math. Math does not care about your feelings. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriftBusta Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 36 minutes ago, motonoggin said: It's an illusion all financed by debt. I'm pretty ok with my illusion, but thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 6 minutes ago, DriftBusta said: I'm pretty ok with my illusion, but thanks. Of course you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriftBusta Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, motonoggin said: Of course you are. I'm glad we cleared that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 9, 2021 Author Share Posted June 9, 2021 Just now, DriftBusta said: I'm glad we cleared that up. You won't live to see the consequences of your entitled generation insisting on this economy, but future generations will understand what the boomers did and why. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SayatodaU.P.eh? Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 9 hours ago, Zambroski said: Personally, I'd prefer the better and quicker service that automation may provide at fast food, and other, places. Service has become unbearable at many. This is a bit "off" in topic but, I've been in the south for about 8 months now and this place is just fucked on the service end. I mean, complete abortion. With very few exceptions, you are treated rudely...like you are bothering the ones being paid to do the customer service. This is in no way my imagination. I've actually started to quasi document some of it to see just how bad it is (my old HR habits dying hard). The fact is, this is what many employers have now...just a bunch of entitled and bitter people seemingly believing they are worth whatever they think they are and have really managed to strangle establishments. Now, I also acknowledge that geography plays into this. We spend a few days back up in DOOLOOTH and I did some patronizing of several establishments. I mean, WOW...don't know what you got, til it's gone. What a difference. I can't wait to get it back again. That’s weird. I usually hear it’s us northerners that are assholes. I know one thing, southern people are typically way more lazy. 8 hours ago, Cold War said: People have no idea what it takes to run a business today. It is just so much easier being a employee. My buddy was in last week. Small FAB shop with 9 employees. Sick of it. I have 10 wives , 18 kids , now. Let someone else deal with all their problems. Yup. I’ll keep my decent paying job with benefits, and wrench on the side at home for “real” money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member EvilBird Posted June 9, 2021 Gold Member Share Posted June 9, 2021 35 minutes ago, motonoggin said: You won't live to see the consequences of your entitled generation insisting on this economy, but future generations will understand what the boomers did and why. Most just dont get it. 19 minutes ago, SayatodaU.P.eh? said: That’s weird. I usually hear it’s us northerners that are assholes. I know one thing, southern people are typically way more lazy. Yup. I’ll keep my decent paying job with benefits, and wrench on the side at home for “real” money. Too damn hot down there they have to move slower. I like the Southern Hospitality tho.. Amazing most of us all have to hustle on the side just to afford the outrageous cost of living a decent life nowadays without a handout. That said small business owners have it EXTREMELY tough right now and I wouldn't want to run a business personally unless it was just me. All the PC bullshit on top of the typical employee headaches no thanks ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anler Posted June 10, 2021 Share Posted June 10, 2021 They have been paying as much as $14/hr or more here for years now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold War Posted June 10, 2021 Share Posted June 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, Anler said: They have been paying as much as $14/hr or more here for years now. Yeah, its all bullshit. People just don’t want to work. Do you think if they offer 15 hr. They will be turning applicants away at the door? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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