teamgreen02 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Quote NEW YORK (AP) — Get ready to pay sharply higher bills for heating this winter, along with seemingly everything else. With prices surging worldwide for heating oil, natural gas and other fuels, the U.S. government said Wednesday it expects households to see their heating bills jump as much as 54% compared to last winter. Nearly half the homes in the U.S. use natural gas for heat, and they could pay an average $746 this winter, 30% more than a year ago. Those in the Midwest could get particularly pinched, with bills up an estimated 49%, and this could be the most expensive winter for natural-gas heated homes since 2008-2009. The second-most used heating source for homes is electricity, making up 41% of the country, and those households could see a more modest 6% increase to $1,268. Homes using heating oil, which make up 4% of the country, could see a 43% increase — more than $500 — to $1,734. The sharpest increases are likely for homes that use propane, which account for 5% of U.S. households. This winter is forecast to be slightly colder across the country than last year. That means people will likely be burning more fuel to keep warm, on top of paying more for each bit of it. If the winter ends up being even colder than forecast, heating bills could be higher than estimated, and vice-versa. The forecast from the U.S. Energy Information Administration is the latest reminder of the higher inflation ripping across the global economy. Earlier Wednesday, the government released a separate report showing that prices were 5.4% higher for U.S. consumers in September than a year ago. That matches the hottest inflation rate since 2008, as a reawakening economy and snarled supply chains push up prices for everything from cars to groceries. The higher prices hit everyone, with pay raises for most workers so far failing to keep up with inflation. But they hurt low-income households in particular. “After the beating that people have taken in the pandemic, it’s like: What’s next?” said Carol Hardison, chief executive officer at Crisis Assistance Ministry, which helps people in Charlotte, North Carolina, who are facing financial hardship. She said households coming in for assistance recently have had unpaid bills that are roughly twice as big as they were before the pandemic. They’re contending with more expensive housing, higher medical bills and sometimes a reduction in their hours worked. “It’s what we know about this pandemic: It’s hit the same people that were already struggling with wages not keeping up with the cost of living,” she said. To make ends meet, families are cutting deeply. Nearly 22% of Americans had to reduce or forego expenses for basic necessities, such as medicine or food, to pay an energy bill in at least one of the last 12 months, according to a September survey by the U.S. Census Bureau. “This is going to create significant hardship for people in the bottom third of the country,” said Mark Wolfe, executive director of the National Energy Assistance Directors’ Association. “You can tell them to cut back and try to turn down the heat at night, but many low-income families already do that. Energy was already unaffordable to them.” Many of those families are just now getting through a hot summer where they faced high air-conditioning bills. Congress apportions some money to energy assistance programs for low-income households, but directors of those programs are now watching their purchasing power shrink as fuel costs keep climbing, Wolfe said. The biggest reason for this winter’s higher heating bills is the recent surge in prices for energy commodities after they dropped to multi-year lows in 2020. Demand has simply grown faster than production as the economy roars back to life following shutdowns caused by the coronavirus. Natural gas in the United States, for example, has climbed to its highest price since 2014 and is up roughly 90% over the last year. The wholesale price of heating oil, meanwhile, has more than doubled in the last 12 months. Another reason for the rise is how global the market for fuels has become. In Europe, strong demand and limited supplies have sent natural gas prices up more than 350% this year. That’s pushing some of the natural gas produced in the United States to head for ships bound for other countries, adding upward pressure on domestic prices as well. The amount of natural gas in storage inventories is relatively low, according to Barclays analyst Amarpreet Singh. That means there’s less of a cushion heading into winter heating season. Heating oil prices, meanwhile, are tied closely to the price of crude oil, which has climbed more than 60% this year. Homes affected by those increases are primarily in the Northeast, where the percentage of homes using heating oil has dropped to 18% from 27% over the past decade. ___ AP Writer David Sharp contributed from Portland, Maine. https://apnews.com/article/business-prices-inflation-28e1231bdb445d482bb2d2e25dff1983 Going to be an expensive winter to heat your home, put gas in your truck, and non-oxy in your sled. If we have a cold winter it is going to get even worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCR1250 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) I just paid $1,599 for 1000 gallons of Propane on Pre-buy, I'll usually only use +/- 700 gallons a season, not too bad, stopped burning wood 3 years ago which was free. Edited October 14, 2021 by XCR1250 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Skidooski Posted October 14, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted October 14, 2021 Thanks Brandon! Building Back Better never looked so good 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamgreen02 Posted October 14, 2021 Author Share Posted October 14, 2021 3 minutes ago, XCR1250 said: I just paid $1,599 for 1000 gallons of Propane on Pre-buy, I'll usually only use +/- 700 gallons a season, not too bad, stopped burning wood 3 years ago which was free. You got off easy at $1.60 a gallon. Wholesale propane is trading for $1.44/gallon right now. If I were you I would do some of the heating with wood if you still have that option. The wood might be "free" but the saws, splitter, wood stove, time, etc. sure isn't. Last year it cost me about $770 for winter heating but I'm on natural gas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCR1250 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Just now, teamgreen02 said: You got off easy at $1.60 a gallon. Wholesale propane is trading for $1.44/gallon right now. If I were you I would do some of the heating with wood if you still have that option. The wood might be "free" but the saws, splitter, wood stove, time, etc. sure isn't. Last year it cost me about $770 for winter heating but I'm on natural gas. I have 6 gas chainsaws, one 60 volt battery chainsaw and a horizontal/vertical 27 ton splitter, sold the woodstove 3 years ago and I'm considering selling most of the other equipment, when I got Lyme's so bad that I couldn't do wood anymore I stopped. Propane was $1.29 here last June, I should have bought it then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member 800renegaderider Posted October 14, 2021 Gold Member Share Posted October 14, 2021 You guys got some good prices. I’m locked in at 2.29 gallon for propane got topped off last week. That’s up from 1.99 last season. Oil is 2.95 here at place I use to use at my old house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdsky Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Obama let the taxpayers cut me a 35% write off on my Geothermal heating and cooling system so I am good until electric goes through the roof and maybe then the green new deal will pay for 30 or 40% off of a new solar array....... Thanks bidentards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ez ryder Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Waiting on @Mainecatto get on here in about 30 days justifying joe in his new sweater sitting in the WH telling us all we need to turn down our thermostat . 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamgreen02 Posted October 14, 2021 Author Share Posted October 14, 2021 40 minutes ago, jdsky said: Obama let the taxpayers cut me a 35% write off on my Geothermal heating and cooling system so I am good until electric goes through the roof and maybe then the green new deal will pay for 30 or 40% off of a new solar array....... Thanks bidentards. You don't think electricity prices are going to go up too? 59% of the electricity in the US comes from goal and natural gas. Look at the price of coal now too. If you pull out hydro from the renewables then they are only around 10% of total electricity generation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member BOHICA Posted October 14, 2021 Gold Member Share Posted October 14, 2021 Here is my electric bill since I started making my own electricity a few months ago. Feels so good not to have to pay for the man for something I can make myself. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted October 14, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted October 14, 2021 Cost me $333 to heat my house last winter, just ordered my heating oil this morning, $773 to heat it this winter..Thanks Joe, glad you're not putting a financial strain on the middle and lower classes... SMH.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 3 hours ago, teamgreen02 said: You got off easy at $1.60 a gallon. Wholesale propane is trading for $1.44/gallon right now. If I were you I would do some of the heating with wood if you still have that option. The wood might be "free" but the saws, splitter, wood stove, time, etc. sure isn't. Last year it cost me about $770 for winter heating but I'm on natural gas. jesus thats cheap. I am usually in the 2-3k range with nat gas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamgreen02 Posted October 14, 2021 Author Share Posted October 14, 2021 4 minutes ago, Angry ginger said: jesus thats cheap. I am usually in the 2-3k range with nat gas. That's the incremental charge with the additional usage. About $45 for the meter and hot water used year round. When our AC went out about 5 years ago we upgraded to a high efficiency forced air furnace. That makes a big difference versus an old standard 80% efficient unit.The boiler for the garage in floor heat is a high efficiency condensing unit also. The only standard efficiency unit we have is the water heater that also doubles as the boiler for the in floor heat in basement. I'm sure we will upgrade that to high efficiency in the future once that goes out (20+ years old). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdsky Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 53 minutes ago, teamgreen02 said: You don't think electricity prices are going to go up too? 59% of the electricity in the US comes from goal and natural gas. Look at the price of coal now too. If you pull out hydro from the renewables then they are only around 10% of total electricity generation. It's definitely going up just like everything else these days but the electric utilities are more restricted than my propane supplier as to price increases hence the reference to picking up a $70 or $80K solar array at a heavily taxpayer subsidized price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snopro31 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 I'm debating doing solar for my garage when its due for shingles but we will see. Currently running electric for the heat and a supplement pellet stove but I will be changing that out to a wood stove and electric furnace. Wood makes sense as I have a life time supply of it on my property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer254 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Thanks Joe!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCR1250 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 1 hour ago, snopro31 said: I'm debating doing solar for my garage when its due for shingles but we will see. Currently running electric for the heat and a supplement pellet stove but I will be changing that out to a wood stove and electric furnace. Wood makes sense as I have a life time supply of it on my property. Put on a Metal roof, I did all my buildings in metal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCR1250 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) Higher oil, gasoline and natural gas prices have political and policy ramifications. They come as President Biden's approval ratings have been trending generally downward in recent months, and Democrats face a high risk of losing one or both chambers of Congress in 2022. Meanwhile, the oil industry is arguing that climate provisions Democrats hope to move through Congress — like a new fee on methane emissions — would raise consumer costs (whether this would be significant is hardly clear). The global energy price and supply crunch might complicate efforts to spur new climate policies at or after the looming UN climate summit. Or it could have the opposite effect, who knows! Go deeper: Global energy crisis could dim climate hopes Edited October 14, 2021 by XCR1250 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 7 hours ago, teamgreen02 said: https://apnews.com/article/business-prices-inflation-28e1231bdb445d482bb2d2e25dff1983 Going to be an expensive winter to heat your home, put gas in your truck, and non-oxy in your sled. If we have a cold winter it is going to get even worse. We average $110 month for natural gas and electricity through WPS. Our f'ng cable/net/landline costs more than our heat/ac/electricity. Glad I still have one sled that happily runs 87 octane and GIVE CREDIT to Polaris for making their 650 87 octane friendly. Premium fuel is getting spensive. That said, my oil investments should pay for a few years of retirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snopro31 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 3 hours ago, XCR1250 said: Put on a Metal roof, I did all my buildings in metal. On the garage I am but I'm not a fan of it on the house. Have it on the cabin and its meh on the noise level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XCR1250 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 1 minute ago, snopro31 said: On the garage I am but I'm not a fan of it on the house. Have it on the cabin and its meh on the noise level. Put fanfold on first, barely hear the noises. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snopro31 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 1 minute ago, XCR1250 said: Put fanfold on first, barely hear the noises. thats what we are missing at the lake. i'll have to remember that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ez ryder Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ActionfigureJoe Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 Listen to the whining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepr2 Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 39 minutes ago, ActionfigureJoe said: Listen to the whining. And another cry for attention…. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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