Justin Trudeau is Doing a Great Job

[revrnd]

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/12/16/canadas-carbon-pricing-is-a-fraud?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=recommend-button&utm_campaign=Canada’s+carbon+pricing+is+a+fraud

[02sled]

26 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said:

Very few of my systems rely on the main data center, in fact most the engineers demand it to be so.  These are all F500 companies,  I am currently reworking a line that is going to be relocated to India and Thailand for a good customer, the data center is of zero concern.

I guess a lot depends on the industry you're dealing with. Manufacturing not only relies on the machinery but they need the systems that order materials, receive them, process payroll and so many more. I know Bombardier Aerospace has a system that relies on their data centre to track work on the aircraft they are building. A worker logs onto a job and off a job associated with a specific aircraft. They log out tools through a computer system and so many more. They also have some stand alone systems as well though. Those that are reliant and there are lots house their systems in data centres that have built in redundancy to avoid down time. Redundant power feeds from the local utility. redundant UPS systems, backup generators, communications networks exiting the building in different routes and then redundant processors. Lose any part of any of the infrastructure and it has an automatic fail over. Step into the finance and banking arena and they grind to a halt without it. Even hospitals are reliant on their systems being available.

Edited December 21, 2016 by 02sled

[ArcticCrusher]

4 minutes ago, 02sled said:

I guess a lot depends on the industry you're dealing with. Manufacturing not only relies on the machinery but they need the systems that order materials, receive them, process payroll and so many more. I know Bombardier Aerospace has a system that relies on their data centre to track work on the aircraft they are building. A worker logs onto a job and off a job associated with a specific aircraft. They log out tools through a computer system and so many more. They also have some stand alone systems as well though. Those that are reliant and there are lots house their systems in data centres that have built in redundancy to avoid down time. Redundant power feeds from the local utility. redundant UPS systems, backup generators, communications networks exiting the building in different routes and then redundant processors. Lose any part of any of the infrastructure and it has an automatic fail over. Step into the finance and banking arena and they grind to a halt without it. Even hospitals are reliant on their systems being available.

Its called MES 02 and yes work orders are tied into production schedules, but you do not want or can afford production to be held up due to data centers being down unless it ties into real time quality checks.  

[02sled]

25 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said:

Its called MES 02 and yes work orders are tied into production schedules, but you do not want or can afford production to be held up due to data centers being down unless it ties into real time quality checks.  

That's why so many companies are no longer operating their own data centres and are opting for managed services in purpose built data centres with all the redundancies built in to make sure they don't have down time. Load balanced servers for a system, one fails the rest pick up the load, they are in different cabinets with dual power feeds from different sources all the way back to the utility feeds into the building. We had 6 different communications routes into the building with 3 heading east and 3 heading west down the street and the diversity was carried through to the servers. Short of the building burning down you would never lose the systems in the building. Then we had a disaster recovery plan with a fail over to another building that would see systems recovered within 24 hours.

Any component of the system, the power or the cooling had a failover that was measured in milliseconds.

[ArcticCrusher]

2 minutes ago, 02sled said:

That's why so many companies are no longer operating their own data centres and are opting for managed services in purpose built data centres with all the redundancies built in to make sure they don't have down time. Load balanced servers for a system, one fails the rest pick up the load, they are in different cabinets with dual power feeds from different sources all the way back to the utility feeds into the building. We had 6 different communications routes into the building with 3 heading east and 3 heading west down the street and the diversity was carried through to the servers. Short of the building burning down you would never lose the systems in the building. Then we had a disaster recovery plan with a fail over to another building that would see systems recovered within 24 hours.

Any component of the system, the power or the cooling had a failover that was measured in milliseconds.

No 02, these companies want no reliance on a data center for production, esp when production is well over > 1 million per day.  The data center is an overhead, not the driving production model.  

[02sled]

1 hour ago, ArcticCrusher said:

No 02, these companies want no reliance on a data center for production, esp when production is well over > 1 million per day.  The data center is an overhead, not the driving production model.  

Like I said depends on the business. Try banking and finance. They grind to a halt if systems are down. Can't give you your money or accept a deposit. Retailers that can't process credit or debit or even scan a code and get the price can't sell anything. Typically if a major retailer had their systems down they would clear the store and lock the doors. 

Health care has become reliant as well. Ontario government has a large DC in Guelph they depend on. It has redundancy built in.

Just the tip of the iceberg. In manufacturing there are countless other systems that are outside those that drive the machinery. In disaster recovery one of the first priority systems is payroll. Employees need to be paid 

Edited December 22, 2016 by 02sled

[revrnd]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/economy/us-launches-investigations-into-canadian-softwood-lumber-dispute/article33376917/?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=Referrer:+Social+Network+/+Media&utm_campaign=Shared+Web+Article+Links&utm_source=Forest+News&utm_campaign=4084fd3ed6-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2016_12_21&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_1e626712e1-4084fd3ed6-53824368

The "Crybaby" has everything under control.

[ArcticCrusher]

13 hours ago, 02sled said:

Like I said depends on the business. Try banking and finance. They grind to a halt if systems are down. Can't give you your money or accept a deposit. Retailers that can't process credit or debit or even scan a code and get the price can't sell anything. Typically if a major retailer had their systems down they would clear the store and lock the doors. 

Health care has become reliant as well. Ontario government has a large DC in Guelph they depend on. It has redundancy built in.

Just the tip of the iceberg. In manufacturing there are countless other systems that are outside those that drive the machinery. In disaster recovery one of the first priority systems is payroll. Employees need to be paid 

1st bold, they are not essential.

2nd bold. Not true, the last ice storm just a few years ago, all systems were down and retailers worked with emergency lighting,  flashlights and receipts on plain paper.  In those situations cash is king.

My point is no customer wants production to grind to a halt if the MES systems go down, that is a poor design in itself.  Workorders can always be sideloaded and processed.  Also none of my customers would ever trust an outside datacentre with intellectual property as for many that is their value add.

[ArcticCrusher]

10 hours ago, revrnd said:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/economy/us-launches-investigations-into-canadian-softwood-lumber-dispute/article33376917/?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=Referrer:+Social+Network+/+Media&utm_campaign=Shared+Web+Article+Links&utm_source=Forest+News&utm_campaign=4084fd3ed6-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2016_12_21&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_1e626712e1-4084fd3ed6-53824368

The "Crybaby" has everything under control.

Make sure they send her along with a case of Kleenex tissues.

[StevieWonder]

Data center's . As important as Cliff Claven at Cheers .... 

[02sled]

2 hours ago, StevieWonder said:

Data center's . As important as Cliff Claven at Cheers .... 

You obviously haven't a clue about how integral the processors have become to everyday life. Crusher seems to think that banking and finance are not essential. Systems are down and you need cash from an ATM or even in your bank branch. Forget it... not going to happen. You need gas at the pump for your truck and you don't have cash, forget it. Not going to happen. All debit and credit transactions go through systems such as Moneris for approval from your bank and that happens on hardware in the Moneris data centre and then your banks data centre. You're in your local large retailer, such as a grocery store or The Bay, Walmart, Canadian Tire, systems are down and the grocery store doesn't have price look up at the register so they don't know how much anything is and they can't accept debit or credit. As a retailer if you accept a credit card that is over limit or would be declined for some reason... you eat the loss.

Have you heard of E-Health in Ontario. That's your medical history. Guess what. That all resides on systems in the Ontario government data centre in Guelph. If those systems are down what will happen when you visit your doctor. He doesn't have a record of what he has done for you already and isn't about to start making notes on paper to update the records later. You get blood work, xrays or other tests done in a lab. Your doctor gets those results electronically and accesses them electronically. They are stored in that Guelph data centre.

Try getting your license plates or drivers license renewed if the systems in the data centre are down. Oh that's right.... it happened not that long ago.

Imagine an airport or an airline if their systems are down and the chaos that creates globally. Oh that's right... it did happen not that long ago, was it American or South West that halted their flights globally.

Yeah the world operates on a bunch of pc's in an office and that's it. For Crusher MES, Mechancial Execution Systems would be his bread and butter but the number of other systems that are critical to business operations are countless.

But hey none of these are important.... as long as the MES systems are working the world is fine. But then they are localized to a building and not reliant on outside connectivity or reliant on other outside systems.

 

Edited December 22, 2016 by 02sled

[StevieWonder]

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz,

 

sorry fell asleep after obviously . 

[ArcticCrusher]

21 minutes ago, 02sled said:

You obviously haven't a clue about how integral the processors have become to everyday life. Crusher seems to think that banking and finance are not essential. Systems are down and you need cash from an ATM or even in your bank branch. Forget it... not going to happen. You need gas at the pump for your truck and you don't have cash, forget it. Not going to happen. All debit and credit transactions go through systems such as Moneris for approval from your bank and that happens on hardware in the Moneris data centre and then your banks data centre. You're in your local large retailer, such as a grocery store or The Bay, Walmart, Canadian Tire, systems are down and the grocery store doesn't have price look up at the register so they don't know how much anything is and they can't accept debit or credit. As a retailer if you accept a credit card that is over limit or would be declined for some reason... you eat the loss.

Have you heard of E-Health in Ontario. That's your medical history. Guess what. That all resides on systems in the Ontario government data centre in Guelph. If those systems are down what will happen when you visit your doctor. He doesn't have a record of what he has done for you already and isn't about to start making notes on paper to update the records later. You get blood work, xrays or other tests done in a lab. Your doctor gets those results electronically and accesses them electronically. They are stored in that Guelph data centre.

Try getting your license plates or drivers license renewed if the systems in the data centre are down. Oh that's right.... it happened not that long ago.

Imagine an airport or an airline if their systems are down and the chaos that creates globally. Oh that's right... it did happen not that long ago, was it American or South West that halted their flights globally.

Yeah the world operates on a bunch of pc's in an office and that's it. For Crusher MES, Mechancial Execution Systems would be his bread and butter but the number of other systems that are critical to business operations are countless.

But hey none of these are important.... as long as the MES systems are working the world is fine. But then they are localized to a building and not reliant on outside connectivity or reliant on other outside systems.

 

So you can't get cash from an ATM, BFD.  Its an inconvenience if anything.

When we have become 100% dependent on a data centre, we have not gained anything.  If the airline systems are down, sure you will be waiting for that, no way around it.  However if a store can't go back to basics like Canadian Tire did during the last ice storm and power outage, then they should not be in business.  You can always call in a credit card if your system is down or say sorry Charlie, come back tomorrow.  Again an inconvenience, not essential.

So now we can't get x-rays if the system goes done?  Fuck Wynnebag.

 

[ArcticCrusher]

11 minutes ago, StevieWonder said:

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz,

 

sorry fell asleep after obviously . 

Its all controlled by Skynet.

[revrnd]

4 hours ago, ArcticCrusher said:

So you can't get cash from an ATM, BFD.  Its an inconvenience if anything.

 

 

Yes, but think of the dickhead in front of you @ Mac's that hasn't got the cash for a pop & bag of chips. If Interact/Moneris goes down, they're fucked.

Look @ Xstrata shutting the Met Site in Timmins a few years ago. It was cheaper for them to truck the concentrate 216 klicks to their smelter in Rouyn Noranda.

http://www.thesudburystar.com/2010/08/06/xstratas-profits-in-wake-of-timmins-closure-a-slap-in-the-norths-face

Mind you the Liberals wouldn't care since the workers being unionized (private sector) would've voted NDP.

 

[ArcticCrusher]

26 minutes ago, revrnd said:

Yes, but think of the dickhead in front of you @ Mac's that hasn't got the cash for a pop & bag of chips. If Interact/Moneris goes down, they're fucked.

Look @ Xstrata shutting the Met Site in Timmins a few years ago. It was cheaper for them to truck the concentrate 216 klicks to their smelter in Rouyn Noranda.

http://www.thesudburystar.com/2010/08/06/xstratas-profits-in-wake-of-timmins-closure-a-slap-in-the-norths-face

Mind you the Liberals wouldn't care since the workers being unionized (private sector) would've voted NDP.

 

Well many times I would not have the cash to pay for the bill at the Tims drive through if the systems were to crash.

My wife always tells me I don't carry enough cash for emergencies.

 

I have done some work for mining Co's and smelters mainly in the US though, but Rouyn and Val'dor are always bust or boom with mining or forestry.

Some great restaurants though.

[Puzzleboy]

Hey Gary....... pretty sure that banking, finance, airlines, and all the other stuff you likely mentioned in your lengthy tome, existed long before computers.  We won't even get into the E-health debacle. 

Sounds to me like you data centre guys really fucked up if there's no suitable contingency plan in place when the power or data goes out. 

 

On 2016-12-22 at 11:55 AM, 02sled said:

You obviously haven't a clue about how integral the processors have become to everyday life. Crusher seems to think that banking and finance are not essential. Systems are down and you need cash from an ATM or even in your bank branch. Forget it... not going to happen. You need gas at the pump for your truck and you don't have cash, forget it. Not going to happen. All debit and credit transactions go through systems such as Moneris for approval from your bank and that happens on hardware in the Moneris data centre and then your banks data centre. You're in your local large retailer, such as a grocery store or The Bay, Walmart, Canadian Tire, systems are down and the grocery store doesn't have price look up at the register so they don't know how much anything is and they can't accept debit or credit. As a retailer if you accept a credit card that is over limit or would be declined for some reason... you eat the loss.

Have you heard of E-Health in Ontario. That's your medical history. Guess what. That all resides on systems in the Ontario government data centre in Guelph. If those systems are down what will happen when you visit your doctor. He doesn't have a record of what he has done for you already and isn't about to start making notes on paper to update the records later. You get blood work, xrays or other tests done in a lab. Your doctor gets those results electronically and accesses them electronically. They are stored in that Guelph data centre.

Try getting your license plates or drivers license renewed if the systems in the data centre are down. Oh that's right.... it happened not that long ago.

Imagine an airport or an airline if their systems are down and the chaos that creates globally. Oh that's right... it did happen not that long ago, was it American or South West that halted their flights globally.

Yeah the world operates on a bunch of pc's in an office and that's it. For Crusher MES, Mechancial Execution Systems would be his bread and butter but the number of other systems that are critical to business operations are countless.

But hey none of these are important.... as long as the MES systems are working the world is fine. But then they are localized to a building and not reliant on outside connectivity or reliant on other outside systems.

 

[02sled]

8 minutes ago, Puzzleboy said:

Hey Gary....... pretty sure that banking, finance, airlines, and all the other stuff you likely mentioned in your lengthy tome, existed long before computers.  We won't even get into the E-health debacle. 

Sounds to me like you data centre guys really fucked up if there's no suitable contingency plan in place when the power or data goes out. 

 

The contingency is that your critical systems reside in a resilient data centre where all the infrastructure is redundant with backup systems in place. Power goes out the redundant battery backup carries the systems while the redundant diesel generators kick in. If one of the generators or one of the UPS battery backups fail the remaining generators or UPS systems handle the load. If one of the communication systems go down one of the other redundant networks carry the communications. That's why you don't have your systems in a closet next to the cafeteria 

[revrnd]

I don't know how much electricity they produced, but the diesel powered backup @ my plant was the same size as the typical diesel locomotive.

Regardless of the size of they businesses, their owners are questioning the logic in continuing to do business in the Ontario w/ the current business model that OPG & Hydro 1 use. 

The 3 Stooges (Trudeau, Morneau & Butts) will continue along on the "Road to Utopia", while the business climate changes drastically south of the border. 

Mind you if every place of business w/ over 4 employees has a gender neutral washroom, every thing will be fine in Canada.

[Puzzleboy]

Battery backups and generators are not from the computer age either. 

And if all data lines are down? 

35 minutes ago, 02sled said:

The contingency is that your critical systems reside in a resilient data centre where all the infrastructure is redundant with backup systems in place. Power goes out the redundant battery backup carries the systems while the redundant diesel generators kick in. If one of the generators or one of the UPS battery backups fail the remaining generators or UPS systems handle the load. If one of the communication systems go down one of the other redundant networks carry the communications. That's why you don't have your systems in a closet next to the cafeteria 

[StevieWonder]

So I google Data Center funny images to razz 02. Whole bunch of these two guys .

And the one guy is Gary , 

 

so Gary , merry Christmas 

[02sled]

54 minutes ago, StevieWonder said:

So I google Data Center funny images to razz 02. Whole bunch of these two guys .

And the one guy is Gary , 

 

so Gary , merry Christmas 

Good one. If you know what hot aisle containment is and how it deals with heat vented out the rear of the servers it becomes even funnier .  Merry Christmas to everyone 

Edited December 25, 2016 by 02sled

[Sksman]

Justin Trudeau loves UN and strives to be a big part of it.

 

Donald Trump calls it a club where people get together, talk and have a good time!

 

who is going to be the better influence on their country as a leader?

[02sled]

There's been a number of dialogues in the media lately about how Truedope is flushing Canada down the toilet with his obsession on climate and things like his carbon tax. Then he has his accomplice Wynnebag with the same obsession and anti business policies. Here you have Trump determined to create an environment where businesses can grow and flourish while tweedle dumb and tweedle dee are driving businesses out of Canada and Ontario. Hardly a week goes by where you don't here of some business relocating to the US

Truedope who still thinks budgets balance themselves promised huge investments in infrastructure. So far nothing. He got some of the worlds largest investors to come and listen but they all went home with their money. They came looking for opportunities where they could make money and that doesn't mean 2% on a loan. They would be behind something like a toll highway such as the 407 where they would see it as an investment and financially viable business. Truedope didn't have anything that was a viable investment. Something like Truedope going on Dragons Den and being told by all the Dragons, I'm out.

Edited December 28, 2016 by 02sled

[ArcticCrusher]

7 minutes ago, 02sled said:

There's been a number of dialogues in the media lately about how Truedope is flushing Canada down the toilet with his obsession on climate and things like his carbon tax. Then he has his accomplice Wynnebag with the same obsession and anti business policies. Here you have Trump determined to create an environment where businesses can grow and flourish while tweedle dumb and tweedle dee are driving businesses out of Canada and Ontario. Hardly a week goes by where you don't here of some business relocating to the US

Truedope who still thinks budgets balance themselves promised huge investments in infrastructure. So far nothing. He got some of the worlds largest investors to come and listen but they all went home with their money. They came looking for opportunities where they could make money and that doesn't mean 2% on a loan. They would be behind something like a toll highway such as the 407 where they would see it as an investment and financially viable business. Truedope didn't have anything that was a viable investment. Something like Truedope going on Dragons Den and being told by all the Dragons, I'm out.

If investors can't do better than 10%  return,  they are better off to stay in the markets,  no hassles,  get out when you want.   

He needs to go on shark tank where he would really be laughed at.