Shooter at Florida high school.

[Highmark]

24 minutes ago, Jimmy Snacks said:

OK...still need to close gun show loopholes...same with private sales.

Gun show loopholes?   Most all gun show purchases go thru the same thing as in a store.   If you are commercially selling guns (at a gun show) you would have to be a FFLD.   Private sales are another thing.   The gun show "loophole" is a myth pushed by the anti-gun movement.   

Edited February 15, 2018 by Highmark

[steve from amherst]

7 minutes ago, Highmark said:

Gun show loopholes?   Most all gun show purchases go thru the same thing as in a store.   If you are commercially selling guns (at a gun show) you would have to be a FFLD.   Private sales are another thing.   The gun show "loophole" is a myth pushed by the anti-gun movement.   

Of course it is. And gun dealers ( licensed ) make up 95 % of those selling guns at gun shows. Almost all other sales are those selling antique guns.

[steve from amherst]

34 minutes ago, Jimmy Snacks said:

OK...still need to close gun show loopholes...same with private sales.

As I mentioned to Neil , without registration there is no way to enforce private sale background checks.  Then you have the simple fact that most of these freaks obtain their guns legaly. The majority of mental health issues in this country are undiagnosed.

[NaturallyAspirated]

37 minutes ago, oleroule said:

' Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, ...'

am i'm missing the part about not being able to pray?

nope...because it's not there.

 

There is a significant difference between leading students in prayer and allowing them to pray on their free time.  The first is obviously objectionable the second not.  

Neal

[Skidooski]

[Highmark]

We should be teaching mandatory classes in HS about being a responsible parent.   It could cover everything from personal finances to paying attention to your fucking kids lives.   If you don't pass you don't graduate.   Passing should be set at a very high standard.   Make it not go against their GP ave if that is a concern but damn we as a nation are dropping the ball when it comes to quality home life.  

[JEFF]

"Actually it is, we already do so with vehicles.  Guns can be, and frankly should be treated in a similar way."

Neal

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

I don't see vehicles listed there?  

[oleroule]

6 minutes ago, NaturallyAspirated said:

There is a significant difference between leading students in prayer and allowing them to pray on their free time.  The first is obviously objectionable the second not.  

Neal

leading them in prayer is not making a law establishing a religion.

 

[oleroule]

4 minutes ago, Highmark said:

We should be teaching mandatory classes in HS about being a responsible parent.   It could cover everything from personal finances to paying attention to your fucking kids lives.   If you don't pass you don't graduate.   Passing should be set at a very high standard.   Make it not go against their GP ave if that is a concern but damn we as a nation are dropping the ball when it comes to quality home life.  

unfortunately that is only as good as the teacher and curriculum.

 

[steve from amherst]

4 minutes ago, Highmark said:

We should be teaching mandatory classes in HS about being a responsible parent.   It could cover everything from personal finances to paying attention to your fucking kids lives.   If you don't pass you don't graduate.   Passing should be set at a very high standard.   Make it not go against their GP ave if that is a concern but damn we as a nation are dropping the ball when it comes to quality home life.  

We should.

The high school I went to was a vocational school . How to start your own business was a mandatory class with the first months focus on personal finance. 

But I agree , it is time to teach kids what their parents don't. 

[Highmark]

29 minutes ago, oleroule said:

unfortunately that is only as good as the teacher and curriculum.

 

I agree but we have to try.   

[NaturallyAspirated]

44 minutes ago, JEFF said:

"Actually it is, we already do so with vehicles.  Guns can be, and frankly should be treated in a similar way."

Neal

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

I don't see vehicles listed there?  

So if it isn't explicit in the Constitution it shouldn't be granted, is that what you are implying?

Neal

[NaturallyAspirated]

42 minutes ago, oleroule said:

leading them in prayer is not making a law establishing a religion.

 

Indeed it is.  SBYL

Neal

[Jimmy Snacks]

1 hour ago, Highmark said:

Gun show loopholes?   Most all gun show purchases go thru the same thing as in a store.   If you are commercially selling guns (at a gun show) you would have to be a FFLD.   Private sales are another thing.   The gun show "loophole" is a myth pushed by the anti-gun movement.   

Are you sure about that...Pretty sure I could rent a table at a gun show in Michigan and sell rifles and shotguns without doing background checks. 

[Skidooski]

1 hour ago, Highmark said:

We should be teaching mandatory classes in HS about being a responsible parent.   It could cover everything from personal finances to paying attention to your fucking kids lives.   If you don't pass you don't graduate.   Passing should be set at a very high standard.   Make it not go against their GP ave if that is a concern but damn we as a nation are dropping the ball when it comes to quality home life.  

And then have them take it again when they learn they are pregnant or adopting

[Mainecat]

1 hour ago, Highmark said:

Gun show loopholes?   Most all gun show purchases go thru the same thing as in a store.   If you are commercially selling guns (at a gun show) you would have to be a FFLD.   Private sales are another thing.   The gun show "loophole" is a myth pushed by the anti-gun movement.   

Private sales at gun shows do not require checks in many states. Honest gun owners would keep away from the private sellers because of not wanting to buy stolen guns. At least I do.

[Mainecat]

A fed permit should be required for every American who owns a gun. This would require safety training along with updates for renewal. The fed permit would supersede every state law. You could carry in every state without having multiple permits.

just do it.

[JEFF]

26 minutes ago, NaturallyAspirated said:

So if it isn't explicit in the Constitution it shouldn't be granted, is that what you are implying?

Neal

Not at all. What I am saying is of the two examples you gave, (Guns and vehicles). One is protected by our constitution and one is not. 

[XC.Morrison]

Just now, JEFF said:

Not at all. What I am saying is of the two examples you gave, (Guns and vehicles). One is protected by our constitution and one is not. 

Cars hadn’t been invented yet.  If guns hadn’t been invented yet then they wouldn’t have been protected either.  

[steve from amherst]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy Snacks said:

Are you sure about that...Pretty sure I could rent a table at a gun show in Michigan and sell rifles and shotguns without doing background checks. 

Yes you could. But hardly anyone does. You can steer a car with your feet, that doesn't make it a good idea. In theory thou , you would be breaking the law. A law that isn't enforced. Given the limited resources of the ATF , they say themselves they don't bother with gun shows as their own research has shown that less then 3 % of guns used in crimes come from gun shows.

[steve from amherst]

And why were guns protected? Because before the revolution the British were trying to impose gun control. In fact the fighting that started at Barrets farm in concord mass was when the british went to confiscate weapons and gunpowder.

[Skidooski]

Closing "gun show loopholes", Fed Registry, Fed permits, required training etc would not have stopped this latest shooting or many of the previous ones would they?

[steve from amherst]

2 minutes ago, Skidooski said:

Closing "gun show loopholes", Fed Registry, Fed permits, required training etc would not have stopped this latest shooting or many of the previous ones would they?

Not at all. Keeping guns from fruitloops will. But who is to decide who is the fruitloop ?

[Jimmy Snacks]

6 minutes ago, steve from amherst said:

Yes you could. But hardly anyone does. You can steer a car with your feet, that doesn't make it a good idea. In theory thou , you would be breaking the law. A law that isn't enforced. Given the limited resources of the ATF , they say themselves they don't bother with gun shows as their own research has shown that less then 3 % of guns used in crimes come from gun shows.

Seriously.....gun shows are packed here and they  aren’t breaking the law.

[Snoslinger]

2 hours ago, steve from amherst said:

Aparently he had a BC done.

The AR-15 was legally purchased by Cruz, Jim Lewis, an attorney representing the family he was living with, told The Sun Sentinel. "The family made him keep it in a locked gun cabinet in the house but he had a key," Lewis said.

 

that family likely has some liability in all this imo. from what ive seen thus far, theyd have to be completely blind to not realize this kid had issues.