Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 17 minutes ago, spin_dry said: Perhaps. Yet since the fall of the USSR Ukraine has developed its own identity and rejects the idea of being part of the Russian Federation. I see the reason for the invasion differently. Ukraine has all 4 ingredients to be a strong nation. Oil, iron ore, coal, and food. It's a nation that can and actually began to stand alone in independence. They're unlike any of Putin's other puppet states that can be bribed and corrupted. Beginning in 2015 Ukraine's GDP grew and stabilized. They contracted with other nations for exports at a pace not seen before. They have all the ingredients to supersede Russia's economy. They also have a stronger work force that's not plagued with alcoholism, chronic unemployment, and mental illness. That is the real threat to Putin and Russia. They are farmers and as such have to work for a living. There is quite a bit of industry that was put there because of the work force. The Antanov 225 was built there along with a good part of the Russian Navy. No question Ukraine will do fine without Russia and blend with Europe with little trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted February 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 7 hours ago, spin_dry said: Simple common sense. Ukrainians were well up to speed and proficient using the HIMAR rocket system long before it was delivered Keep us posted Maverick! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 5 minutes ago, X2700 said: Unfortunately sooner or later American soldiers will be fighting and dying in this war.just giving Ukraine weapons and training will not win this war. is their ever a winner in war? Yes , the pieces of shit that get rich off them. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepr2 Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 hours ago, SnowRider said: Another lie Yes, your selective outrage about lies is laughable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepr2 Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Keep us posted Maverick! His call sign would be chicken shit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share Posted February 23, 2023 8 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Keep us posted Maverick! Congress already approved $100 million to train Ukrainians to fly the F16's. Listen and you'd know that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted February 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, spin_dry said: Congress already approved $100 million to train Ukrainians to fly the F16's. Listen and you'd know that. Sounds good Mav! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share Posted February 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Sounds good Mav! I think it sounds excellent!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted February 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 13 minutes ago, spin_dry said: I think it sounds excellent!!! Oh I'm well aware Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 32 minutes ago, spin_dry said: Congress already approved $100 million to train Ukrainians to fly the F16's. Listen and you'd know that. It is the Abrams tanks that should give the Russians night sweats. It could be possible to put 1000 M1A2 tanks in Ukraine in a few years time which would completely change Russian defense policy for decades to come. The Russians would be staring down the Ukrainians the Polish and 3 Nato countries to their north all of which are armed to the teeth with the latest and greatest. The Abrams and the F16 give the Ukrainians top of the line equipment but more importantly available in large numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted February 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 19 hours ago, spin_dry said: You didn’t even know that. Always 5 steps ahead of poor sludgy. The US defense dept gets a glimpse of Russia’s 5th generation combat jet capabilities against a known target. Invaluable intel. Yeah because the 4 working jets are such a threat to us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 22 minutes ago, Highmark said: Yeah because the 4 working jets are such a threat to us. Like most Russian super weapons on paper they are unstoppable but in practice they kind of suck. There are two types of fighter jets today F22s and targets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted February 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 31 minutes ago, Carlos Danger said: Like most Russian super weapons on paper they are unstoppable but in practice they kind of suck. There are two types of fighter jets today F22s and targets. If the SU-57 was so incredible how come its not terrorizing Ukraine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member EvilBird Posted February 23, 2023 Gold Member Share Posted February 23, 2023 Zelensky is a fucking menace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 9 minutes ago, EvilBird said: Zelensky is a fucking menace. A menace in the same way GWB was. A useful idiot playing his part and being controlled by those that actually make the decisions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 15 hours ago, Carlos Danger said: Shall we hear from the last president who probably understood the Russian problem. Russia has an infection that makes them believe in empire building through conquest. hundreds of years of czar rule of war and conquest did not get wiped away by 70 years of the soviet system. Nixon was wise at the time he was POTUS to build stronger relationships with China and put a wedge between them and Russia. That has now all but disappeared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 hour ago, ArcticCrusher said: Nixon was wise at the time he was POTUS to build stronger relationships with China and put a wedge between them and Russia. That has now all but disappeared. Oh I disagree. The relationship Nixon put in place has made it so China's relationship with the west is more valuable than it's relationship with Russia. Even if in their little Communist hearts they would like to favor Russia the money brings them back to reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Highmark said: If the SU-57 was so incredible how come its not terrorizing Ukraine? They are afraid to use it to close to the front lines. Even the SU 35 has had a stand off BVR role keeping a good distance from front lines. The Russian air force is built for defense not power projection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share Posted February 23, 2023 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Carlos Danger said: They are afraid to use it to close to the front lines. Even the SU 35 has had a stand off BVR role keeping a good distance from front lines. The Russian air force is built for defense not power projection. That’s interesting. I always wondered why Russia built cheap and expendable aircraft for defense and didn’t build in air power as a force multiplier for troop support. It’s because their country is so big that they needed cheap stuff built in record numbers for defending an immense border. It’s also one of the reasons that a battle with NATO would result in a 1000:1 kill ratio. They have no aircraft for troop support. Edited February 23, 2023 by spin_dry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 38 minutes ago, spin_dry said: That’s interesting. I always wondered why Russia built cheap and expendable aircraft for defense and didn’t build in air power as a force multiplier for troop support. It’s because their country is so big that they needed cheap stuff built in record numbers for defending an immense border. It’s also one of the reasons that a battle with NATO would result in a 1000:1 kill ratio. They have no aircraft for troop support. The Russians ground attack plane is one of their bright spots. The SU 25 Frog foot is a ground support plane like an A 10 that both sides have. The Ukrainians have used it to effect. The other problem the Russians have is the centralized command and control left over from the Soviet system which makes the aggressive use of airpower nearly impossible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share Posted February 23, 2023 38 minutes ago, Carlos Danger said: The Russians ground attack plane is one of their bright spots. The SU 25 Frog foot is a ground support plane like an A 10 that both sides have. The Ukrainians have used it to effect. The other problem the Russians have is the centralized command and control left over from the Soviet system which makes the aggressive use of airpower nearly impossible. The method being used by the Russians, both with the frog and helicopters, is to shoot gobs of unguided munitions at a ground target. Very poor for effective ground support. The frogs were getting blown out of the sky by the handful during the early days of the war. The Russians never developed good air cover for troops. Their specialty is to just throw bodies en mass at the enemy. They did it in WWII and they’re doing it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlos Danger Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 1 minute ago, spin_dry said: The method being used by the Russians, both with the frog and helicopters, is to shoot gobs of unguided munitions at a ground target. Very poor for effective ground support. The frogs were getting blown out of the sky by the handful during the early days of the war. The Russians never developed good air cover for troops. Their specialty is to just throw bodies en mass at the enemy. They did it in WWII and they’re doing it now. The Russians have been throwing bodies at front lines in mass since the first Crimea war in the 1850s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anler Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 The US spent $100 million teaching US pilots to speak Ukrainian LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted February 24, 2023 Share Posted February 24, 2023 8 hours ago, Carlos Danger said: Oh I disagree. The relationship Nixon put in place has made it so China's relationship with the west is more valuable than it's relationship with Russia. Even if in their little Communist hearts they would like to favor Russia the money brings them back to reality. China just told Biden to fuck off and pound sand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted February 24, 2023 Author Share Posted February 24, 2023 42 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said: China just told Biden to fuck off and pound sand. China has been reduced to buying products on the retail market to cannibalize the mid and high end semi-conductor processors for military use. Thanks Uncle Joe!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.