f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, Highmark said: Sorry but neither cat nor doo had an externally adjustable rear suspension. I'll list just a few things Doo has had the other haven't had or copied. -Smart tether tied specifically to the sled and where a dealer can make timing and other adjustments. -Rave valves. -Externally adjustable limiter on mt. sleds. Yes Cat had on for one year on the race sled on the HB but it was junk. -2 stroke Turbo. -System for automatic sumerization/fogging. -Break in mode. (now they all have it) - 2 stroke engine tech they all have been playing follow the leader.....well except Yam...they just gave up because they couldn't compete 20 years ago. -Batteryless electric start. Doo just does the little things very well. Still the only one where you can change windshields without tools. The 2 stroke turbo is an embarrassment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 minute ago, f7ben said: The 2 stroke turbo is an embarrassment best OEM mountain sled motor by a mile and does exactly what they wanted it to 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, Angry ginger said: best OEM mountain sled motor by a mile and does exactly what they wanted it to Yah....they wanted it to be expensive and boring compared to real turbo sleds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 minute ago, f7ben said: Yah....they wanted it to be expensive and boring compared to real turbo sleds You're missing the whole point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildboer Posted February 18, 2021 Author Share Posted February 18, 2021 43 minutes ago, 800renegaderider said: Well they did. I’ve been skimming multiple websites about the release I have yet to see one person says they are going out to buy one. Have you? All I’m seeing is people happy the Mach is back and disappointed people about it not being over 200hp and not being a 2stroke triple. A lack luster 20k sled that no one is gonna want. I agree it should have been over 200hp, but plenty of people will complain and buy one anyway. A two stroke triple would be awesome, but we all know that's not gonna happen. They're not designing a whole new engine for just one model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member 800renegaderider Posted February 18, 2021 Gold Member Share Posted February 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, Wildboer said: I agree it should have been over 200hp, but plenty of people will complain and buy one anyway. A two stroke triple would be awesome, but we all know that's not gonna happen. They're not designing a whole new engine for just one model. The one year only thing is bull shit. It’s just a way to sell there crap sled they know no one is gonna want. It’s like a 50% off mattress sale. I’m sure people will buy it I have no doubt of that but if they built something that destroyed the competition and no one else has like a triple or big bore twin with 200+ they’d sell a ton more without the need for there 1yr only mattress sale gimmicks to get people to buy them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted February 18, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, f7ben said: The 2 stroke turbo is an embarrassment 19 minutes ago, Angry ginger said: best OEM mountain sled motor by a mile and does exactly what they wanted it to Its EXACTLY what a consumer turbo Mt. sled should be. You know Ben nobody is EVER going to produce what you want because in a production consumer version its unrealistic. If you had any inkling at all about all the things that goes into engineering, designing, testing, producing and backing up these sleds with warranty you might have a different attitude. Have you ever even ridden out west before? Edited February 18, 2021 by Highmark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, Highmark said: Its EXACTLY what a consumer turbo Mt. sled should be. You know Ben nobody is EVER going to produce what you want because in a production consumer version its unrealistic. If you had any inkling at all about all the things that goes into engineering, designing, testing, producing and backing up these sleds with warranty you might have a different attitude. Have you ever even ridden out west before? They could have easily made it turbocharged instead of turbo normalized. It’s gay as fuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdsky Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, 800renegaderider said: The one year only thing is bull shit. It’s just a way to sell there crap sled they know no one is gonna want. It’s like a 50% off mattress sale. I’m sure people will buy it I have no doubt of that but if they built something that destroyed the competition and no one else has like a triple or big bore twin with 200+ they’d sell a ton more without the need for there 1yr only mattress sale gimmicks to get people to buy them. Agree that the one year messaging is to get buyers off their thumbs that want one and pull the trigger. It's not at all like a mattress sale because Doo would have had to put a $40K price tag so dealers could then discount it to $20K so idiots could then think they are getting a super deal. Destroy the competition? Not possible. They could have brought it with 250HP and idiots would be talking up how their 300HP tuned up winder will kick it's ass. It would be a fools game. What will be interesting and what nobody seems to be talking about is how it fares against a bone stock winder running the numbers. My guess is it will be a bit closer race now and again, win or lose, everyone disputes the rules and conditions and rider ability and on and on and on. 1000cc big bore or triple? Never gonna happen. Those happy days are over friends thanks to the EPA. Just like your favorite sports car coming soon with all electric propulsion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted February 18, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, f7ben said: They could have easily made it turbocharged instead of turbo normalized. It’s gay as fuck Again....have you rode out there? Do you have any idea how great it is to have a sled there with sea level power levels? They couldn't "easily" have made it more HP. You still have to realize the average idiot consumer they are dealing with. You have to realize the fuels available. You are just not realistic. Aftermarket turbo's running 190+ HP are not that reliable. You have to ride there to understand the trouble you get in when a sled breaks down at the bottom of a mt. and there is only one way out.....back up. Edited February 18, 2021 by Highmark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 Just now, Highmark said: Again....have you rode out there? Do you have any idea how great it is to have a sled there with sea level power levels? They couldn't "easily" have made it more HP. You still have to realize the average idiot consumer they are dealing with. You have to realize the fuels available. You are just not realistic. Are you claiming they couldn’t have made it make 3lbs boost at sea level on pump gas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, jdsky said: Agree that the one year messaging is to get buyers off their thumbs that want one and pull the trigger. It's not at all like a mattress sale because Doo would have had to put a $40K price tag so dealers could then discount it to $20K so idiots could then think they are getting a super deal. Destroy the competition? Not possible. They could have brought it with 250HP and idiots would be talking up how their 300HP tuned up winder will kick it's ass. It would be a fools game. What will be interesting and what nobody seems to be talking about is how it fares against a bone stock winder running the numbers. My guess is it will be a bit closer race now and again, win or lose, everyone disputes the rules and conditions and rider ability and on and on and on. 1000cc big bore or triple? Never gonna happen. Those happy days are over friends thanks to the EPA. Just like your favorite sports car coming soon with all electric propulsion. no reason for it to happen. triples are just fond memories, the 4 stroke T is the new triple it just doesn't have the sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 Just now, Angry ginger said: no reason for it to happen. triples are just fond memories, the 4 stroke T is the new triple it just doesn't have the sound. The sidewinder sounds pretty damn good. Turbo 1200s sound amazing. Turbo apex is like music 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted February 18, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted February 18, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, f7ben said: Are you claiming they couldn’t have made it make 3lbs boost at sea level on pump gas? For what reason? They don't make mt. sleds for the UP mt. wanna be's. Sea level idiots come out of bars don't let the sleds warm up then want to take off across the lake full throttle. Edited February 18, 2021 by Highmark 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Member 800renegaderider Posted February 18, 2021 Gold Member Share Posted February 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, jdsky said: Agree that the one year messaging is to get buyers off their thumbs that want one and pull the trigger. It's not at all like a mattress sale because Doo would have had to put a $40K price tag so dealers could then discount it to $20K so idiots could then think they are getting a super deal. Destroy the competition? Not possible. They could have brought it with 250HP and idiots would be talking up how their 300HP tuned up winder will kick it's ass. It would be a fools game. What will be interesting and what nobody seems to be talking about is how it fares against a bone stock winder running the numbers. My guess is it will be a bit closer race now and again, win or lose, everyone disputes the rules and conditions and rider ability and on and on and on. 1000cc big bore or triple? Never gonna happen. Those happy days are over friends thanks to the EPA. Just like your favorite sports car coming soon with all electric propulsion. Mattress sale idk you get what I meant I just couldn’t think of any other sales gimmicks lol. I agree the big bore or triple most likely won’t happen but at least if your gonna use a 900t throw some head studs and a bigger turbo on it and give it say 225hp stock and build it to handle more leaving plenty on the table for the aftermarket to get 300. You get all the bragging right for having most hp factory sled ever and at the same time it makes the Mach live up to it’s name. I would have much rather seen that than a launch controller and fancy shocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildboer Posted February 18, 2021 Author Share Posted February 18, 2021 31 minutes ago, 800renegaderider said: The one year only thing is bull shit. It’s just a way to sell there crap sled they know no one is gonna want. It’s like a 50% off mattress sale. I’m sure people will buy it I have no doubt of that but if they built something that destroyed the competition and no one else has like a triple or big bore twin with 200+ they’d sell a ton more without the need for there 1yr only mattress sale gimmicks to get people to buy them. The Mach Z is a gimmick to introduce the 900turbo R, the the money comes from selling the same engine in other models across the lineup... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 31 minutes ago, Wildboer said: The Mach Z is a gimmick to introduce the 900turbo R, the the money comes from selling the same engine in other models across the lineup... it’s the same engine you feeb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireball 440 Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 They introduced a new tune and lower suspension and called it a new model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, Fireball 440 said: They introduced a new tune and lower suspension and called it a new model. Exactly ....should have been 2k more than a comparable 2021 900T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awful knawful Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 Mach is similar price as a winder, with way more technology. Same hp, more modern chassis, better suspension, smart shocks, traction control. Buy it. Don't buy it. WGAF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awful knawful Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 20 minutes ago, Fireball 440 said: They introduced a new tune and lower suspension and called it a new model. New tune, larger injectors, intake, exhaust, lowered suspension, smart shocks, launch control. Compared to a winder it's pretty loaded up with technology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 25 minutes ago, f7ben said: it’s the same engine you feeb Supposedly different intake and exhaust but the engine and turbo are the same. If it has any advantages with a tune it’ll be minimal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 Mach Z won’t compete with a thundercat. That’s just how doo does stuff. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awful knawful Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 1 hour ago, f7ben said: Yah....they wanted it to be expensive and boring compared to real turbo sleds By boring do you mean pull and go? Not fucking with it all day? Because AM turbo kits still are not 100% yet. The skidoo is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awful knawful Posted February 18, 2021 Share Posted February 18, 2021 29 minutes ago, f7ben said: it’s the same engine you feeb Best multi use engine in all of power sports. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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