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Been through the topic with a number of these sleds. One disclaimer is that some are just plain worse. Doesn't seem to matter the year. I have noticed that the mapping varies and the good runners using a bit less gas and oil also heat up faster most of the time. Not a fan of scratchers, but they do throw snow. I use the qualipiece mounting system and between the lines idler wheel hanger. The work ok and they'll keep you riding. The coat hangers work better. I like the qualipiece mount because I can put the bracket on the rails and mount the scratcher as needed during a trip. Until I need the scratchers, I just throw a bolt with a rubber washer through the big hole. When I know the trip is going suck hot balls, I put at least one scratcher into the mount. I've also found some other tricks to get by most of the time. Club grooming is a big factor. I've seen many occasions on the same trail where temps change dramatically when you hit the next club. My advice is to ride through that section and see how the next club section cools. Don't lollygag through the hot sections. The track needs to move snow. It also helps to be in the powervalves a little to get the gas in there. Wide open does create more heat, so it doesn't work for long. Getting that flap down low helps through the bad sections. Sit way back on the seat and drag the flap, or put the fat ass on the hot sled. Put the hot runner in the back of the pack. It's surprising how much a couple sleds can loosen snow on the trail for cooling. Tunnel flares help a little bit. The stock flares are a one size fits all and don't go back to the flap on 137 sleds. I make my own flares out of 1/8" polycarbonate. It's way cheaper than stock flares and I can make them fit each sled. I've dealt with these things and the quirky temps for awhile. The difference between two exact same sleds is surprisingly dramatic. Some heat up faster in the morning Some run higher temps on the trail all day long. Some have real problems and go straight to hot when temps start climbing. I've found some bad thermostats, had a waterpump go kaput and other issues. But, in the end, some just run hot. It's become an inside joke about the "hot" sleds.

I have used a MN company called Blown Concepts for some stuff. He will make pretty much anything you want. Not sure on your price range? I'll also note that he uses a film media that is different than stock. It is a heavier, thicker materiel without the micro perforations for lay down. It goes on with what I'd describe as heat shrinking.

I ride with glasses. I tend to ride sorta speedy, so lots of head wind. Have a Mission, 509 R3L Ignite carbon fiber, Klim f4, and TXI with heated visor. The Mission and TXI are the easiest with glasses. Once they are adjusted, both can slap on and go. The Mission takes a little time with setup, the TXI just needs the correct face grommet. The 509 needs fiddling to keep from fogging glasses and colder temps don't work well. Seems almost odd because the visor creates enough heat to feel it on my face. It moves a lot of air and is comfy. Those two vents on top of the visor are like skull air conditioning. I use it with warmer temps and freezing rain snow. The Klim is for warm sunny days. Lots of free air movement, easy breathing, and comfy. It works well and goes on fast if I'm not worried about bare skin. The Mission is a bit amazing in cold. It is warmer, but not bad. It must be moving air quite well since fogging is non existent. Oddly, you just don't feel the cold air moving around the melon. Glasses even stay fairly clear while not moving. It isolates the breath well. The helmet is relatively quiet. Downsides in cold, you must make sure it latches shut. Ice will build up so it's hard to close. Also not a huge fan of the rubber face grommet getting cold when taking longer stops. It's not a big deal, but it's annoying. The nose/face grommet positioning is critical in the Mission. I've kablanged my skull wrapper and the dang thing pinches the nose shut. Take time to set up the thing. Not much to mention about the TXI. It's the easiest in the bunch. Just slap it on and ride. It's a bit noisy and fit isn't perfect, but it's still my banger helmet. Glasses are easy to manage.

That's funny as hell and so true. For the rest of you guys, I'll give a little back story. Most of the time I ride with this bud who is a "numbers person" in every possible way. He farms a fair number of acres and raises quite a few hogs too. His operation is by the numbers. And he knows the numbers. He can rattle off the cost breakdown of an equipment purchase to cents an acre while adding in depreciation, fuel, interest, etc. Ask how many hours are on the combines, tractors, other equipment, or vehicle odometers, he knows exactly how many. Those numbers are rattling around in his head all day long. The numbers thinking rolls over into sledding. We will fill all the sleds and he's doing the mileage math on each one as the nozzle clicks. If we talk about options for trails on the day, he says that's 26.4 miles + 18.1 after the intersection, bla, bla, bla. The numbers are right there and they are dead on. He could also tell you the average mph of any one of our sleds right off the top of his head. Our group usually stays in places where we can cook. He brings bacon. Don't know his butcher, but the bacon is dang good. One place we stayed for years was owned by an older couple. It was common to have them join for breakfast and the bacon was their thing. The old lady just started to call him Mr Bacon. That rolled over to everyone else using the same term. In that part of the U.P. he is known as the bacon man. Ironically, his first name is Kevin.

It's funny that you mention the warm up time. I'm a bit of a stickler for letting them "warm up" before it's hammer time. I used to check the coolers and when they felt warm, I figured it was ok to start slow riding until they came up to full temp. I'm mostly riding Cat sleds and they switched to a two stage thermostat years ago. I don't know if it's the thermostat or different flow, but it takes longer to reach running temps now. I can go and make a sandwich while I'm waiting on some of those cold days. In the old days, I had a few sleds with higher average speeds, but I didn't have time to take a piss before the sled was up to running temps. I've never timed them to see how much longer they take now, but it is a significant increase in time. It probably adds up a lot when you do that every day.

That's actually higher than most sleds on the trail. In fact, I'd call it scootin along with that kind of number. Why do you think the number will decrease? I usually see the average go up after break in and early season junk riding.

Most riders would be surprised if they actually figured out their real average MPH with that calculation. It's lower than they think. We tend to see higher numbers based on riding area and a demented mentality in our group. We generally check at the end of each day to see how much the number changed. I don't know how the OEM gauges do the average speed. I see riders post high numbers and I bet those are moving averages. I also run a NS1 setup with one sled and look at the graphing when I get a chance. It surprises me how much throttle position varies even then I thought I was really hauling the mail.

There is a carryover from the last year of 7B that was not spent. It seems hard to believe, but there was money left on the table. Budgets are biennial, so the overall dollars belong to a two year frame. In the last year they reduced? K - 12 spending because of less students. It does seem hard to believe, but the chunk of money is pretty big. There was some help from the feds on healthcare. Inflation sucks, but when you tax dollars spent, the numbers will rise when people buy the same things. People are buying more, so the revenue number is really climbing. The dollars are worth a little less, but their numbers are growing faster than inflation. An actual recession would change the surplus considerably. There is also a crazy side to some of the other numbers. Gambling revenue, from the E pulltabs, dedicated to paying for the new stadium has gone up too. I don't think that falls under the surplus dollars. It's a lot of money from a small source. Enough to pay off the bill dang early. I'm not a fan of spending money just because it is there. I sure hope we don't go down that path. Again, I want to state that the rural areas need to get involved. A bunch of the money will get spent no matter what. We can sit at the end of our driveways and complain, or we can do something.

I wonder what we would say if there was a minus sign in front of that number? I agree that it feels like they are playing with our money already partially paid. - The last part based on the "biennium" nature of budgets. Obviously some of the bucks rolled in from the feds and that helped the numbers grow. But, I'm sure there is a long list of people waiting with their hands open while somebody is ready to start writing checks. We can sit around bitching and pretending there is no plan. It's foolish. There are tons of people with plans. I feel like it's our job to make sure those one time and legacy programs don't get all the air time. Right now, they are. The next budget proposal is mandated to be released by the end of Jan. We can sit around and complain until then, and complain more after the proposal is public. Or, we can actually do something. My time is split between two parts of this state. Outstate and metro. I'm not a fan of the metro, but it's my reality of life. I choose to spend as much time outstate as I can. I will note that there is a big contrast in how people deal with big issues. When problems arise outstate, people generally buckle down and get it done. I like that approach. In the metro, people get organized, get in front of decision makers, and get money to get things done. I hate to say it, but the outstate crowd is missing an opportunity if they don't play in this round. There are big bucks at stake and the metro crowd is already in the game. It's our time (outstate) to speak up, do something, and affect the outcome.

That continuous marketing is interesting. It doesn't help much in the real world. It's kinda interesting to explore the concept of nothing breaking. I should be the poster child of that. I don't do engine mods. I reinforce weak areas on the sleds. The clutching that I do is for longer belt life and eliminating over rpm/slipping. I also don't weigh crap. I wish the marketing was true. I wouldn't mind a repair list that includes nothing. Going back to the original question again. I used to push these dang sleds a lot harder. It's just not as much fun anymore. I see what breaks and I'd rather keep riding. Even with my mellower habits, I'm still putting my butt on spare seats way too often.

Funny thing about that video. I think I've rode worse crap in the U.P. when it's busy and grooming equipment is down. They add in another hazard up there. There is also a pile of ding dongs coming from the other direction. It's a hell of a workout physically and mentally. To the original topic if that is allowed around here. I haven't slapped a leg over the seat on a turbo for any real running. They are fun as heck, but more than I'd like to hang on to all day. Been running Cat 800 tinker toys most of the time and push them until I figure out what breaks. Then, I usually try to come up with a fix to get the thing to last longer. The old belt thing was a friggin expensive PIA. That issue alone changed a lot of riding habits. I don't run at 100% for long anymore. Things just seem to break too fast when you hold em tight. The slow evolution of changes over the years does let you hold them closer to the tippy top longer. I do like the speed thing, so I try to clutch for higher speed cruising without popping the jug holders apart. The best answer to the topic in may case might be that I use about 90% of the power about 75% of riding time. The riding time percentage would be higher if I didn't worry about the ding dong factor.

I like the idea of what you are thinking. Look for rubber pad with adhesive though. Even the best weather stripping is too soft. It breaks down/crushes pretty quick and starts to trap little debris. I've used a few variations rubber padding over the years. One of the biggest challenges was finding a place that stocks the stuff. The right thickness is a big deal so you can get the parts to fit and still eliminate movement. I've used tool box drawer liner, stair tread grips, and PWC gripper mat material. The PWC matting is great and comes in a variety of color and thickness combinations. Anything with the 3M adhesive backing will stick like crazy. It is hard to find right now with a lot of shops doing seasonal shut downs, so finding the right one is tricky. I've also seen quite a variety of furniture anti slip pad stuff. I have not tried any of those products, but they might be worth a look. Those are in quite a few of the home improvement and hardware stores.

@Deephaven, has some good tips. I didn't see what season you are heading to stay. If you are going outside of holiday time, the car option is even better. Things are busy when everyone is on holiday. That would make a difference in what you plan or just wing it. Berlin is a changed city. It may be interesting to see the new vs. old. It wouldn't keep you interested for that length of time. Are you staying with relatives that live in the city? I'm inclined to ask residents before anyone from outside the area. Traveling by car or train is relatively easy. I wouldn't get hung up on a single form of travel. Some of the sites will be a bear with car parking. Some will need a car to reach easily. My inlaws are scattered around Germany and Austria. We go to different parts of the region each time we visit. Food and bier are regional items. There is quite a bit of advice about what to try. It may not happen depending on where you travel. BTW, Berlin is one city I have not seen yet. My wife has been there a lot and keeps telling me it is something I have to see at least once. Friends that lived there before and after say the same. The comments about building a Capital city out of nothing are a recurring theme. If you get a chance, try to see the new "zone" and further out in the "old city" region. The contrast is dramatic and it will not last long.

Both, but the factors are relative. They don't perform miracles. If you burn off hyfax in ten minutes, these might last fifteen. If you have good wheels, the drag difference isn't a lot. I run them and I've never found them cheap. For the price alone, the standard hyfax are cheaper even when you go through more sets. One advantage on the Cat rails is the larger size. I'm picky about alignment and watch it close. The larger size keeps them a little closer to true. If you don't watch alignment, the clips will dig into the sides.

I bet he wouldn't give it a second thought. The dude lives for an audience.

I still have a TXI that works dang good. Nice simple helmet that doesn't fog. It allows plenty of fresh breathing air. It also works well with glasses. I wish somebody would make an updated version without all kinds of knick knacks. Make it lighter and update the face grommet material. I'm fine with making my own sound deadening if I need. It seems crazy that nobody has figured out how to make a simple helmet like the TXI that actually works.

That would be quite a bit of money for the right to blather your opinions. And then, the others would need to pay just to know how important you are. Thank God I'm not that important. I'm sticking to my right of free speech. We still have that right if I'm correct.

I appreciate @Jimmy Snacks, for grabbing and posting that statement from the club. The issues and statements around liability have been as stated for quite some time with all trails that fall under the DNR umbrella. Skinner was blowing smoke with his statements. I'm surprised he even bothered making excuses. The guy is trying to drum up support from his cronies and the community. The sad part is that some people will fall for his line of B.S. I guess that would be his excuse for making excuses. The saddest part of this whole deal is that money talks. Skinner can throw out BS until the sun doesn't shine and it won't stop him from wrecking one of the last trail options. It seems crazy that local businesses are not getting peeved. They already know what has happened with less snowmobiles. Turning those numbers down to zero would be a real disaster. There is also the other side of money talk. Snowmobilers spend a lot of money. We support a lot of businesses. Where and how we spend can be a useful tool. We are pretty lucky that Steve Hamilton is involved. He is one of the main reasons this trail even existed after the original trail was lost with the previous club management. Steve is a doer and he has done a lot of work to get this trail. He also has a lot more class than Skinner. He sticks to the facts and speaks the truth. We could use a little more of that kind of character. It's a tough deal all around. Terrain is a factor. There is a reason why the grade and highway run right next to each other through that stretch. Next time you're on that highway through there, look left and look right. That is also why there are three ski hills and Copper Peak are right next to each other in that stretch. The area is beautiful to see if you can get there.

They actually did a nice job keeping the trail away from any areas that would have had pedestrians or skiers. At Indianhead, it does cross two access road going to the ski area parking. That section is also close to a few condos that overlook the upper lot. It is the latest section added to the reroute and winds like a bugger through the woods between Wakefield and Indianhead. I'm guessing this is the portion that is raising the stink. The portion around Blackjack runs on the ROW of a road going to the lower lodge. That section has been in place a long long time. I completely forgot about the clubs groomer barn. They run most of the stuff on that end out of a facility in Bessemer. The trail closure would definitely impact the operations. Sure, they can run along the roads. Oddly enough, there are not many E - W through roads in that area. Some of the old mine pits are big buggers and I'm not sure who controls that property. Running equipment along Hwy. 2 would not be fun. I would not be surprised if they ran equipment on the old grade trail. It is the most direct route and is sized for equipment.

Bummer deal. I know that area well. That is the reroute being used since they lost the old section running the grade through Bessemer. I had talked with Steve after he took his position about trying to get the old trail back. We talked about how this thing couldn't last with the way it ran through the ski resorts and around the Condos. Sledders have been doing plenty of stuff off trail and a lot of tracks were close to those businesses. On a side note - I've never seen tracks going to the ski hills. That reroute has been some sort of open invitation for people to head off trail along the pipeline. The current reroute is not convenient for riding or grooming. It is prone to turning into mud quick with the odd sun exposure and gazillion sharp turns and stop signs. The combination of issues has killed traffic volume. I'm a little surprised that some local businesses wouldn't get more involved. I bet the volume is down more than 70% vs. the old trail. Basically, the Hurley, Ironwood, and Bessemer, overnighters have moved further East. Losing this trail would probably put the final nail in quite a few of those businesses. I ride that area often. I used to ride it a lot more. It was nice to use Ironwood - Wakefield as a good starting point. There were quite a few room and entertainment options. Riding to the U.P. or Wisconsin system was easy. That section of trail has changed our riding and lodging. We drive further in rigs and stay further East. Honestly, I think we've only bought WI permits once since that route was changed. I'm sure there are plenty of riders coming from the WI side that have done the same with MI riding. It would certainly be even worse if they lose the current reroute. There is some strange irony with that trail problem. This pic was taken at one of the ski resorts in 2012. Businesses could partner with the sledding community. Ironwood is still trying with racing. I looked pretty seriously around Wakefield/Bessemer for a property to use as a home base. When they lost the old corridor section, I quit looking in that area. It felt like they were becoming the end of the line in the trail system. Losing this section would truly make it the end of the line.

My dealer has been pestering Cat for years. He says that they should put anything they are thinking about releasing under my butt for a season to see what breaks. I don't go banging off rocks and trees. I never do engine mods. I do like putting on some "brisk" miles. For some reason, the mashed potato minefield in the U.P. is hard on sleds if you use the flipper. Cat has generally kept their testing in house. I get that. It would probably be beneficial to also put some of their new tech under real riders before full production. Stuff breaks. Some ideas are just plain bad. Fix the problem before everyone else has the same dang sled.

I had an 800 ext and it just plain worked well. I did a better rear shock and motor mounts. Simple to ride and simple to beat. That skid was the right size for that chassis. And the damn thing was comfortable. Easiest riding sled I've owned. The turbo probably took care of the last thing it didn't have. Top end. I ran big windshield and aggressive carbides. I don't recall seeing triple digits.

I'm not too surprised. I've seen amazing amounts of inventory sitting in holding lots for Ag manufacturers. Autos are in the same boat. All waiting for little parts. I'd hate to be a component buyer for anyone in manufacturing nowadays. That used to be relatively simple. Talk to the list of suppliers and negotiate the details. Now, you have to find someone that can even supply the parts before negotiating details. The realistic manufacturing companies have been laying out long extended timelines for specific components held up by supply shortages. I think Doo is late to the game with their "Over Promise, Under Deliver" OPUDer, policy. These timelines existed long before they took orders.

I get the arguments for running belts. Try counting the belts on a modern combine. Quite a few of those are CVT style too. There are also plenty of chains. Between the two options, I think the chains fail at a higher percent. Environment doesn't help. Dust and fine dirt are the norm. That issue also brings up an argument against chain drives. We run those buggers in oil on sleds. I guess chains don't like snow and water. We had some road work done by the house this summer and they brought in a Wirtgen soil stabilizer It basically dropped a set of teeth through the pavement and ground the whole works to fine aggregate in one pass. Pretty slick machine and not cheap. That big ol roto tiller ran off a belt. Belts can do the job. I do think they may struggle more with some riding conditions.

I'd tend to agree. High speed riding in mashed potato stutters is even worse than jumping. The sleds are running right at the limit of their output on flat land power and those beaters can last for hours at crack. I've heard that you can break stuff if you ride like that all day. Of course, I wouldn't know. I ride like an old lady.