2024 Sleds... what's coming

[Not greg b]

1 hour ago, awful knawful said:

No.

Yamaha has the money and people to do whatever they wish.

They choose not to.

Because they loose money doing it. They aren’t in business to loose money producing something. 

[krom]

1 hour ago, awful knawful said:

No.

Yamaha has the money and people to do whatever they wish.

They choose not to.

You're one of those clowns??

I've been hearing for over 20 years that yamaha could build the best sled if they wanted to. 
That is obliviously not the case, they've proven countless times that they can't.  You have to go back almost 30 years since they built anything close to as good as the other manufactures.

Unless you believe that everyone in the company set out over 30 years ago, with a plan to design and build shitty machines on purpose, and over the course of those 30 years, not a single person deviated from that plan, or wanted to build something good.

[Deephaven]

Well, they basically hired rejects from Cat & Poo in rural WI for their chassis development so not sure why you would expect they'd have something better than the others.  If they leveraged Japan in a better way then yes awful is right.

[Deephaven]

Of course Cat isn't leveraging Textron so....

[krom]

27 minutes ago, Deephaven said:

Of course Cat isn't leveraging Textron so....

Textron owns the company that is making the fuel system for the catalyst, and has been dealing with garmin for a long time in the aerospace arena....

Edited March 18, 2023 by krom

[awful knawful]

1 hour ago, krom said:

You're one of those clowns??

I've been hearing for over 20 years that yamaha could build the best sled if they wanted to. 
That is obliviously not the case, they've proven countless times that they can't.  You have to go back almost 30 years since they built anything close to as good as the other manufactures.

Unless you believe that everyone in the company set out over 30 years ago, with a plan to design and build shitty machines on purpose, and over the course of those 30 years, not a single person deviated from that plan, or wanted to build something good.

You sound upset.

[Deephaven]

26 minutes ago, krom said:

Textron owns the company that is making the fuel system for the catalyst

Explains why they are paying too much for it.

26 minutes ago, krom said:

...and has been dealing with garmin for a long time in the aerospace arena....

Dealing with.  What leverage!!!

You missed the point completely.  Engineering resources and knowledge is leverage.  Buying components is exactly what free market anything does.  Yamaha sleds were really separate from Yamaha, more of a customer for their engines.  Textron is treating Cat the same...which makes me wonder when they supply their own shitty 4 strokes.

[Doug]

29 minutes ago, krom said:

Textron owns the company that is making the fuel system for the catalyst, and has been dealing with garmin for a long time in the aerospace arena....

And then there's the results of the close working relationship with garmin 

[jdsky]

Not really sure why Yamaha stays in the snowmobile game at this point.  Cannot be much of a money maker as the sales volumes are miniscule so it's not even a good outlet for their motors.  Maybe they sell just enough to cover costs or squeek out a tiny bit of profit due to the fact they must have very little manufacturing costs at this point. 

If anything it's likely the kids sleds that keep them hanging around as the profit margins have to be completely ridiculous on those things at their current price points. 

[Kevin]

1 hour ago, Not greg b said:

Because they loose money doing it. They aren’t in business to loose money producing something. 

That may have been a factor pre Covid but any manufacturer of toys today is making money on them.

[Kevin]

2 minutes ago, jdsky said:

Not really sure why Yamaha stays in the snowmobile game at this point.  Cannot be much of a money maker as the sales volumes are miniscule so it's not even a good outlet for their motors.  Maybe they sell just enough to cover costs or squeek out a tiny bit of profit due to the fact they must have very little manufacturing costs at this point. 

If anything it's likely the kids sleds that keep them hanging around as the profit margins have to be completely ridiculous on those things at their current price points. 

Gives the northern dealers something to do/sell in the winter

[Doug]

6 minutes ago, jdsky said:

Not really sure why Yamaha stays in the snowmobile game at this point.  Cannot be much of a money maker as the sales volumes are miniscule so it's not even a good outlet for their motors.  Maybe they sell just enough to cover costs or squeek out a tiny bit of profit due to the fact they must have very little manufacturing costs at this point. 

If anything it's likely the kids sleds that keep them hanging around as the profit margins have to be completely ridiculous on those things at their current price points. 

What does Yamaha have for development and overhead.  Nothing.  They're suppling an engine that's been in production since 2016 so no development cost there.  Produce the motor and sell it.  Give some away on credit to build Blue Arctic Cats.  Free profit with no development cost

[Not greg b]

4 minutes ago, Kevin said:

That may have been a factor pre Covid but any manufacturer of toys today is making money on them.

The only reason Yamaha is making money in the snowmobile market for the last decade is they have no over head in it. They write a check Textron for their yearly order. 

[Not greg b]

13 minutes ago, jdsky said:

Not really sure why Yamaha stays in the snowmobile game at this point.  Cannot be much of a money maker as the sales volumes are miniscule so it's not even a good outlet for their motors.  Maybe they sell just enough to cover costs or squeek out a tiny bit of profit due to the fact they must have very little manufacturing costs at this point. 

If anything it's likely the kids sleds that keep them hanging around as the profit margins have to be completely ridiculous on those things at their current price points. 

They only reason they are doing it, is to keep the Yamaha customer in the Yamaha dealer. Say Yamaha drops sleds all together. Big power sports guy chooses to go with skidoo now since no Yamaha. Yamaha guy sees the new sea doo while he is in there getting something snowmobile related. Likes what he sees about the new sea doo and decides to try one of those to. Yamaha keeps the sleds to avoid this. 

[jdsky]

Except the dealer I 

44 minutes ago, Not greg b said:

They only reason they are doing it, is to keep the Yamaha customer in the Yamaha dealer. Say Yamaha drops sleds all together. Big power sports guy chooses to go with skidoo now since no Yamaha. Yamaha guy sees the new sea doo while he is in there getting something snowmobile related. Likes what he sees about the new sea doo and decides to try one of those to. Yamaha keeps the sleds to avoid this. 

Makes sense for single line dealers but two dealers I work with have Yamaha, Doo and Poo products in their showrooms.  There are some smaller dealers with Yamaha only but they are getting fewer and far between.  I know of at least one small Yamaha dealer in Northern WI that only has their marine products and no dirt or snow at all.  They rent sleds in the winter but they get Doo for their rentals. 

[Deephaven]

1 hour ago, Not greg b said:

The only reason Yamaha is making money in the snowmobile market for the last decade is they have no over head in it. They write a check Textron for their yearly order. 

Not so sure.  Textron probably writes them a check and gives them sleds.  No brainier.

[Not greg b]

1 hour ago, Deephaven said:

Not so sure.  Textron probably writes them a check and gives them sleds.  No brainier.

Probably some kind of combo of that. Yamaha makes out like a bandit as they don’t have to put the sled together and retain the parts business. 

[Not greg b]

Also it appears my 2022 snow check won’t be coming anytime soon. Maybe brp will buy them out and I will get my sled 

[Crnr2Crnr]

16 hours ago, Not greg b said:

Probably some kind of combo of that. Yamaha makes out like a bandit as they don’t have to put the sled together and retain the parts business. 

yeah, but all the people from Yamaha have to come watch the Textron employees put the sleds together and make sure the decals are installed correctly.  

16 hours ago, Not greg b said:

Also it appears my 2022 snow check won’t be coming anytime soon. Maybe brp will buy them out and I will get my sled 

no one saw that coming... snowmobilers were going to be early adopters of EV technologies from what I've read.

 

[jdsky]

Maybe the the shit for brains in DC will give sledders a $7K tax break to buy battery powered sleds that go 50 miles before needing a recharge and 25 miles if you don't ride like dumstad.

[p51mstg]

On 3/18/2023 at 2:46 PM, Not greg b said:

Also it appears my 2022 snow check won’t be coming anytime soon. Maybe brp will buy them out and I will get my sled 

I always figured BRP would buy them.  Now, might as well wait until the bankruptcy fire sale.

[Crnr2Crnr]

https://www.arcticinsider.com/inside-look-there-is-a-2024-zr-7000-and-pantera-7000/

Edited March 21, 2023 by Crnr2Crnr

[airflite1]

8 hours ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

https://www.arcticinsider.com/inside-look-there-is-a-2024-zr-7000-and-pantera-7000/

You're famous, Jimmy will now worship you, you're the best friend ever, no other friend is even close, in fact all his other friends now suck....

[Deephaven]

Interesting that the guy who is mad we know who he is uses his real name again.

And such a witty reply so worthy of AI.  He should be PROUD!!  Go Jimwit!

[Not greg b]

I was at the my dealer today. They have catalyst to sell, so they aren’t sold out, unless you want an xc. Another interesting fact. Everyone that comes in looking to buy a catalyst want the rxc because of the color.