ArcticCrusher Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 9 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said: The stats are misleading, since not all of our agricultural products are supply managed. Chicken, eggs and dairy are. I’m not aware of others, so to say that 60% of our agricultural products are for export as an attack on this system is disingenuous. Isn't cheese as well? Also get a kick out of the quota/bidding system with goods like sugar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: Whether it is 10%, 60%, or 100%, the point is the same. It is protectionist subsidization and tariffing that is hypocritical at best. If we want to talk about being disingenuous, look no further than Canadian trade policies. The outrage is in losing a system generated advantage that these countries had over the US. But we are the bad guys for asking for fair and free trade... If you don’t like protectionist trade policies enacted on you, don’t have protectionist trade policies of your own. What Trump is doing is extremely transparent. He doesn’t want steel and aluminum tariffs. He knows those will make you guys and others drop their tariffs THAT WERE ALREADY IN PLACE! It’s smart, and I’d be willing to bet it will work. do you think trump is a genius or something, and none of this has been considered, or looked at, prior? what is going to happen is that some US jobs may improve in one area, but others will suffer in other areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 minute ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: You can’t bitch at a company for going with the most economical option. The role of our government should be ensuring that there is true competition for US steel. That’s what he is doing... You can find fault with Donald all day, but he isn’t barking up a random tree here. I can bitch about a hypocrite, double standard asshole-in-chief all I want.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 6 minutes ago, Snoslinger said: what makes this even funnier? trump used, and is likely still using, foreign made steel for their jobs..... He's not stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) Just now, ArcticCrusher said: He's not stupid. he is, but not as dumb as many of his supporters.... Edited June 11, 2018 by Snoslinger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtralettucetomatoe580 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Snoslinger said: do you think trump is a genius or something, and none of this has been considered, or looked at, prior? what is going to happen is that some US jobs may improve in one area, but others will suffer in other areas. What US jobs are going to suffer if we bluff one tariff to get them to remove protectionist trade measures then remove the controversial tariff in question? Where do we end up? Simple, lesser barriers on the other side and an expanded market for US producers. That doesn’t equate to a loss of jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Snoslinger said: he is, but not as dumb as many of his supporters.... Would it be fair to say that trump is more intelligent than you are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: What US jobs are going to suffer if we bluff one tariff to get them to remove protectionist trade measures then remove the controversial tariff in question? Where do we end up? Simple, lesser barriers on the other side and an expanded market for US producers. That doesn’t equate to a loss of jobs. it's something called "retaliation".... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtralettucetomatoe580 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, Snoslinger said: I can bitch about a hypocrite, double standard asshole-in-chief all I want.... Don’t be a child... Use your brain on this and do the math. It works, but the downside is you have to kick some shins in the process. End of the day, whether Canadians or Europeans want to admit it, we hold more power and can withstand more than they can. Just the facts. Our consumer economy is the largest in the world. We have the power to play silly games. I don’t think that is the intent. The intent is bluffing them to drop their own tariffs and subsidies while we don’t add any. That, no matter how you shake it out, is a win for us. End of story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtralettucetomatoe580 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, Snoslinger said: it's something called "retaliation".... Retaliation only hurts if it can be sustained by an equal. They don’t want any part in that. You know how you know this to be true? They are suggesting political based tariffs. Tariff Harley’s, bourbon, and cranberries. Impact to our economy? Zero. But it puts pressure politically. They know if they put tariffs on real staples, it would devastate their consumer buying power. The US on the other hand has so many tentacles out that we just adjust the supply chain and see a mere hiccup. Take the left media spin out of this and use your head. It’s all right there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 minute ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: Don’t be a child... Use your brain on this and do the math. It works, but the downside is you have to kick some shins in the process. End of the day, whether Canadians or Europeans want to admit it, we hold more power and can withstand more than they can. Just the facts. Our consumer economy is the largest in the world. We have the power to play silly games. I don’t think that is the intent. The intent is bluffing them to drop their own tariffs and subsidies while we don’t add any. That, no matter how you shake it out, is a win for us. End of story. my instinct says it is not going to work. you may think it will, because one industry, like steel, may get a bit of a boost. meanwhile, retaliation for other products will take a hit, and be less visible. it's my opinion the whole system has been "balanced" somewhat. we are already a very wealthy nation, and I doubt if poorer countries are going to help make us even wealthier, while making them poorer. we are not the only consumers in the world. then there's the part about them all hating trump. well, except putin. which brings up another topic - can you seriously not see what trump is doing here? exactly what putin wants..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev144 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Tariffs on good Canadian milk, trump will have a tantrum if he can't get his milk and cookies before bed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 4 minutes ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: Retaliation only hurts if it can be sustained by an equal. They don’t want any part in that. You know how you know this to be true? They are suggesting political based tariffs. Tariff Harley’s, bourbon, and cranberries. Impact to our economy? Zero. But it puts pressure politically. They know if they put tariffs on real staples, it would devastate their consumer buying power. The US on the other hand has so many tentacles out that we just adjust the supply chain and see a mere hiccup. Take the left media spin out of this and use your head. It’s all right there... exactly what I just said. those things and others will have a negative impact on our jobs, just not as visible, and you trumpsters will call it all a win... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xtralettucetomatoe580 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, Snoslinger said: exactly what I just said. those things and others will have a negative impact on our jobs, just not as visible, and you trumpsters will call it all a win... Omg... Woosh. They won’t mess with jobs. They are tariffs on singular companies and industries that are luxury goods. They are targeting political leaders’ states. Ryan and Mitch... It has and will have zero macro impact on our country. I doubt Harley would even see a drop in profits. Our tariffs, however, will be brutal. You are trying so hard to jump through narrative hoops that you are losing perspective of the facts. Gather your thoughts and try again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Highmark Posted June 11, 2018 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Snoslinger said: my instinct says it is not going to work. you may think it will, because one industry, like steel, may get a bit of a boost. meanwhile, retaliation for other products will take a hit, and be less visible. it's my opinion the whole system has been "balanced" somewhat. we are already a very wealthy nation, and I doubt if poorer countries are going to help make us even wealthier, while making them poorer. we are not the only consumers in the world. then there's the part about them all hating trump. well, except putin. which brings up another topic - can you seriously not see what trump is doing here? exactly what putin wants..... How does consumers in other countries being able to buy our goods for less than what they were paying hurt these so called "poorer countries?" Your remarks have hints of "we are wealthy so let them take advantage of us." As for the bold.... Edited June 11, 2018 by Highmark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: Omg... Woosh. They won’t mess with jobs. They are tariffs on singular companies and industries that are luxury goods. They are targeting political leaders’ states. Ryan and Mitch... It has and will have zero macro impact on our country. I doubt Harley would even see a drop in profits. Our tariffs, however, will be brutal. You are trying so hard to jump through narrative hoops that you are losing perspective of the facts. Gather your thoughts and try again. no, you are trying so hard to find a reason to give trump some credit that you can't see shit. obviously if things we export get high tariffs, demand will drop, causing job losses. maybe not a shit load at Harley, or joe's cranberries, or jack daniels, but those will all add up and wipe out any advances in steel. again, why you think this stuff hasn't been considered before is a little mind boggling... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, Snoslinger said: no, you are trying so hard to find a reason to give trump some credit that you can't see shit. obviously if things we export get high tariffs, demand will drop, causing job losses. maybe not a shit load at Harley, or joe's cranberries, or jack daniels, but those will all add up and wipe out any advances in steel. again, why you think this stuff hasn't been considered before is a little mind boggling... 40% of Harley's sales come from outside the US. That won't hurt them at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICEMAN! Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 38 minutes ago, Highmark said: True, not all are supplied managed but that doesn't change the fact that a huge portion of Canada's agriculture industry is exported with 30% going to the US. If we were doing it right we would slap a 280% tariff on all agricultural products coming into the US from Canada until fair trade is accomplished. This is about fair trade, the US isn't asking for an advantage. You already have a trade SURPLUS with Canada. How much more “fair” do you want? We don’t want your system in regards to dairy, chicken and eggs. 34 minutes ago, xtralettucetomatoe580 said: Whether it is 10%, 60%, or 100%, the point is the same. It is protectionist subsidization and tariffing that is hypocritical at best. If we want to talk about being disingenuous, look no further than Canadian trade policies. The outrage is in losing a system generated advantage that these countries had over the US. But we are the bad guys for asking for fair and free trade... If you don’t like protectionist trade policies enacted on you, don’t have protectionist trade policies of your own. What Trump is doing is extremely transparent. He doesn’t want steel and aluminum tariffs. He knows those will make you guys and others drop their tariffs THAT WERE ALREADY IN PLACE! It’s smart, and I’d be willing to bet it will work. You guys subsidize dairy farms to the tune of $22 billion dollars in 2015. If we dropped supply management, you’d have to stop subsidizing farms and dairy farms would go tits up all over the place. Our system is stable and it’s not going to change. 29 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said: Isn't cheese as well? Also get a kick out of the quota/bidding system with goods like sugar. Cheese is dairy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momorider Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 2 hours ago, hayward said: I don't know about high grade anymore. Hearing a lot of welders complaining about the chinese shit you nooks keep stamping your name on and sending down here..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momorider Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 42 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said: Isn't cheese as well? Also get a kick out of the quota/bidding system with goods like sugar. Maple Syrup, fisheries, timber, cheese, eggs, poultry probably others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revkevsdi Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 What's different about the tariffs this time? https://www.politico.eu/article/bush-trump-tariffs-why-steel-and-aluminum-failed-when-president/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T1R9sledder Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Snoslinger said: my instinct says it is not going to work. you may think it will, because one industry, like steel, may get a bit of a boost. meanwhile, retaliation for other products will take a hit, and be less visible. it's my opinion the whole system has been "balanced" somewhat. we are already a very wealthy nation, and I doubt if poorer countries are going to help make us even wealthier, while making them poorer. we are not the only consumers in the world. then there's the part about them all hating trump. well, except putin. which brings up another topic - can you seriously not see what trump is doing here? exactly what putin wants..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racinfarmer Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 11 hours ago, revkevsdi said: sounds like it’s agreed that the milk is no good and Canada and Europe are right to ban the sale. I put 0 weight into anything you have to say about ag, be it Canadian or US or Euro ag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 17 minutes ago, racinfarmer said: I put 0 weight into anything you have to say about ag, be it Canadian or US or Euro ag. Well it is kevvyboomboom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revkevsdi Posted June 12, 2018 Share Posted June 12, 2018 47 minutes ago, racinfarmer said: I put 0 weight into anything you have to say about ag, be it Canadian or US or Euro ag. I'm not a farmer, I'm just reading links about Canada not allowing milk with growth hormones and the US still allowing farmers to use them to increase milk output. Could explain why so many Americans have bitch tits. Do yours hurt when you hit moguls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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