Roosting Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, f7ben said: $15 and I expect that to only be a month or 6 weeks. I basically just want to make sure he at least shows up. He just turned 21 and has zero skills aside from willingness to learn and that’s just fine with me. No problems here bro all good. If I thought you were serious I would not respond but I know the style you use here and figured we could have some good debate on the subject. And you just described why entry level jobs start low and go up with experience (ie merit) Moto wants that entry job to feed a family of 4. Can you justify that payout for what you just described? no it's not realistic. now if said mcd employee somehow managed to work there for 8 years (why anyone would want too) then there wage should adjust for experience ( ie merit). and could very well amount to a living wage for a family of 4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 Just now, f7ben said: Yah....well being able to comfortably load and chain down an skidsteer and a 14k lb excavator on a few different trailers is gonna take more than 10 minutes. It’s not a fucking weed wacker on your landscape trailer. I also said he needs to learn his way around the sawmill and by that I mean just offbear and stack wood properly. He’s working 20hrs per week to start and I expect to have him close to full time by the fall. Oh so he's entry-level now so you pay him less?? You pay based on experience?? Interesting.. And you can stop attempting to insult me by saying it's a lawn mower or weed Wacker, I've owned my business for 18 years and actually know how to run it. When you're on your 18th year in business that you started completely on your own, without papas help come talk to me little lady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 8 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Okay, so what do you pay to work on the farm?? Lowest and highest hourly rate and then we can divulge into why there are different rates.. You're trying to change the subject. Again. 3 minutes ago, Roosting said: No problems here bro all good. If I thought you were serious I would not respond but I know the style you use here and figured we could have some good debate on the subject. And you just described why entry level jobs start low and go up with experience (ie merit) Moto wants that entry job to feed a family of 4. Can you justify that payout for what you just described? no it's not realistic. now if said mcd employee somehow managed to work there for 8 years (why anyone would want too) then there wage should adjust for experience ( ie merit). and could very well amount to a living wage for a family of 4. I'm sure Ben is glad he has your approval. LMAO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roosting Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, motonoggin said: You're trying to change the subject. Again. I'm sure Ben is glad he has your approval. LMAO go enjoy the fruits of others labor. Have a good weekend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 Just now, Roosting said: go enjoy the fruits of others labor. Have a good weekend I will note that you nor anyone else has provided an educated, objective rebuttal of the facts. All you have are appeals to emotion and opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Oh so he's entry-level now so you pay him less?? You pay based on experience?? Interesting.. And you can stop attempting to insult me by saying it's a lawn mower or weed Wacker, I've owned my business for 18 years and actually know how to run it. When you're on your 18th year in business that you started completely on your own, without papas help come talk to me little lady The business is my business that’s been in existence since 2006. My dad and I are partners in this portion of it which I run and he helps with since he’s retired. I wouldn’t insult you if you didn’t make idiotic comments about someone with zero experience learning to load and secure 150k worth of heavy equipment in 10 minutes. Edited June 11, 2021 by f7ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roosting Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, motonoggin said: I will note that you nor anyone else has provided an educated, objective rebuttal of the facts. All you have are appeals to emotion and opinion. you have not provided a coherent argument or any pertinent real world examples of your ideology working or flourishing in any way shape or form. So you could start there............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 minute ago, Roosting said: you have not provided a coherent argument or any pertinent real world examples of your ideology working or flourishing in any way shape or form. So you could start there............... we’ll it’s never been tried so there’s that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roosting Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, f7ben said: we’ll it’s never been tried so there’s that It's been tried many times with many variants but no success. ever. Just like now he can argue till he turns blue in the face but it's just not a realistic dream to 99% of the population. He should just keep watching re-runs of star trek and hope to get into star fleet. LoL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 3 minutes ago, Roosting said: It's been tried many times with many variants but no success. ever. Just like now he can argue till he turns blue in the face but it's just not a realistic dream to 99% of the population. He should just keep watching re-runs of star trek and hope to get into star fleet. LoL It’s never been tried Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 23 minutes ago, Roosting said: you have not provided a coherent argument or any pertinent real world examples of your ideology working or flourishing in any way shape or form. So you could start there............... I'm not even advocating for communism in this discussion, you're shifting the goalposts because you can't coherently address my points about exploding debt and stagnant wages. I'm telling you how to avoid communism, and you're demanding a defense of communism. It's absurd and a good indicator that you have no cogent response to my points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 31 minutes ago, motonoggin said: You're trying to change the subject. Again. Nope, not trying to change the subject, just seeing if you're a hypocrite, you know, if you actually "walk the walk" so please, feel free to answer or continue to deflect and look like....well you know.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 16 minutes ago, f7ben said: It’s never been tried This is correct. Communism is a moneyless, stateless, classless society. Many states have aspired to achieve communism, but the fact that they're a state immediately excludes them from the definition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Nope, not trying to change the subject, just seeing if you're a hypocrite, you know, if you actually "walk the walk" so please, feel free to answer or continue to deflect and look like....well you know.. You're trying to apply microeconomic solutions to a macroeconomic problem, and attacking the messenger instead of the message. This is a typical tactic of someone trying to avoid cognitive dissonance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 26 minutes ago, f7ben said: The business is my business that’s been in existence since 2006. My dad and I are partners in this portion of it which I run and he helps with since he’s retired. I wouldn’t insult you if you didn’t make idiotic comments about someone with zero experience learning to load and secure 150k worth of heavy equipment in 10 minutes. Oh so you guys are owner operators, so now that you have the employee who is not an owner you are now paying workman's comp?? What is that per year?? and obviously you had to add him to insurance policy as he is loading equipment going down the road, prolly driving the equipment on public roads in your businesses vehicle, so background check, license check?? Add him to vehicle policy.. Right?? Addition to the payroll company also?? You offering up 401k?? Profit sharing?? Obviously you offered him health insurance too?? You know all those things that business like McDonald's offers but a bit lower pay rate.. McDonald's here pays $17/hr to start, same with Bk, and Dunkin... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 Just now, Rigid1 said: Oh so you guys are owner operators, so now that you have the employee who is not an owner you are now paying workman's comp?? What is that per year?? and obviously you had to add him to insurance policy as he is loading equipment going down the road, prolly driving the equipment on public roads in your businesses vehicle, so background check, license check?? Add him to vehicle policy.. Right?? Addition to the payroll company also?? You offering up 401k?? Profit sharing?? Obviously you offered him health insurance too?? You know all those things that business like McDonald's offers but a bit lower pay rate.. McDonald's here pays $17/hr to start, same with Bk, and Dunkin... Why isn't your breakfast Sammie $100??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 8 minutes ago, motonoggin said: You're trying to apply microeconomic solutions to a macroeconomic problem, and attacking the messenger instead of the message. This is a typical tactic of someone trying to avoid cognitive dissonance. Or you could just answer and show us all how you are not a hypocrite,..let me guess, you pay bud trimmers with product?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 Just now, motonoggin said: Why isn't your breakfast Sammie $100??? I don't buy breakfast sammies, I make my own, way better,..I'll post a pic tomorrow, I got these everything bagel hamburger buns,..to die for!! Check them out!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 7 minutes ago, Rigid1 said: Or you could just answer and show us all how you are not a hypocrite,..let me guess, you pay bud trimmers with product?? More deflection from the subject of discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, motonoggin said: Labor is a very small share of the cost of production. While worker wages have stagnated, worker productivity has steadily increased. That means there is less and less labor cost per unit produced. well we can always destroy the productivity by letting the workers run things and then they can make even less without the evil owners and management around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, Angry ginger said: well we can always destroy the productivity by letting the workers run things and then they can make even less without the evil owners and management around It's hilarious watching you guys tie yourselves in knots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry ginger Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 minute ago, motonoggin said: It's hilarious watching you guys tie yourselves in knots. you keep thinking your the smartest guy in the room. we'll continue to laugh at the idiocy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted June 11, 2021 Author Share Posted June 11, 2021 Just now, Angry ginger said: you keep thinking your the smartest guy in the room. we'll continue to laugh at the idiocy. It's not hard around here, but what I'm talking about isn't that hard to understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Rigid1 Posted June 11, 2021 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, motonoggin said: More deflection from the subject of discussion. Nope, not one bit, I've just asked what you do in your business that's different and what you advocate for compared to a McDonald's or any others capitalist business in America that you are against..This discussion is about being paid a living wage buy a business in America,..you and bhen own businesses, sooooo, I'm asking the question..you just don't seem to want to answer for some reason?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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