Pickering Pedestrian Bridge Fiasco

[revrnd]

I'd like to know the back story on this clusterfuck.

Worker: "There's no holes in this section to pass the bolts thru to the adjoining sections."

Foreman: "Get a cutting torch and blow some holes in it!"

Worker: "OK"

How in the world do you install something upside down?

I seem to recall the bridge being almost completed then sat for months with one section above the 401 wrapped in plastic tarps. It was quite awhile before the bridge was opened to pedestrians.

[02sled]

1 hour ago, revrnd said:

I'd like to know the back story on this clusterfuck.

Worker: "There's no holes in this section to pass the bolts thru to the adjoining sections."

Foreman: "Get a cutting torch and blow some holes in it!"

Worker: "OK"

How in the world do you install something upside down?

I seem to recall the bridge being almost completed then sat for months with one section above the 401 wrapped in plastic tarps. It was quite awhile before the bridge was opened to pedestrians.

But they still got a bonus and got another contract

[StevieWonder]

Meh , it's a pedestrian bridge .... Now if it was a sled bridge , ESP with Yammis crossing it , that would be different .

 

 

[Puzzleboy]

There is NO way Liberal Steve's union brothers fucked this up.  

 

Obviously an Engineering or Management screw-up.

[02sled]

6 hours ago, Puzzleboy said:

There is NO way Liberal Steve's union brothers fucked this up.  

 

Obviously an Engineering or Management screw-up.

Of course not. They recognized the design flaw and corrected it. Self made job security. They get paid to come back and fix it.

[DeezNutz]

The result of lazy engineers and architects using cut and paste specs and drawings. Happens on every project. 

[revrnd]

As a tool & die maker I'd see LH & RH details weren't always just a "flipped" design. Easy to assume there was a mistake, but the print would have separate drawings. Most of the time a print would say, "RH shown, LH opposite"

[ArcticCrusher]

28 minutes ago, DeezNutz said:

The result of lazy engineers and architects using cut and paste specs and drawings. Happens on every project. 

Very true.

 

Municipal projects were the worst, since specs were considered just a guide.

Edited December 2, 2016 by ArcticCrusher

[DeezNutz]

2 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said:

Very true.

 

Municipal projects were the worst, since specs were considered just a guide.

People think so highly of engineers until they actually have to deal directly with them and realize just how little they know. 

[04nightfire]

.

Edited December 2, 2016 by 04nightfire

[ArcticCrusher]

40 minutes ago, DeezNutz said:

People think so highly of engineers until they actually have to deal directly with them and realize just how little they know. 

Hey now.

When you get new grads entrenched with the design.  I used to love the boiler-plate specs that would spec out obsolete components.

They are much better in the private sector as they rely on OEM's more for design information.  Corps that use the large consulting engineers for anything other than building construction tend to screw up a lot.

[Puzzleboy]

You're confusing design knowledge with practical applications, and real-world hurdles.  If we left bridge or building designs to the workers, everything would collapse. 

So I wouldn't say they know little. 

 

4 hours ago, DeezNutz said:

People think so highly of engineers until they actually have to deal directly with them and realize just how little they know. 

[DeezNutz]

30 minutes ago, Puzzleboy said:

You're confusing design knowledge with practical applications, and real-world hurdles.  If we left bridge or building designs to the workers, everything would collapse. 

So I wouldn't say they know little. 

 

Of course, builders would cut corners every chance they could. 

[Puzzleboy]

And not know the first thing about materials' strength, fatigue, environmental concerns, among other things.....

[Stoney]

4 hours ago, Puzzleboy said:

And not know the first thing about materials' strength, fatigue, environmental concerns, among other things.....

Do you wear one of the magical Eng. rings, Puzzleboy!

[Sksman]

6 hours ago, Puzzleboy said:

And not know the first thing about materials' strength, fatigue, environmental concerns, among other things.....

Believe what you want.  Many builders can form a bridge beam or parking garage form without an engineer design.  Yes they may have learned from a drawing initially.  Yes rebar crew follows a drawing.  But how many times do you think they need to do before they are pretty competent builders?  They are not all idiots looking to skimp a dollar of steel or concrete.  In fact most would overbuild as the longer they work, more they are paid.  In actual fact design engineers would be skimpers for their bonus on project.  Cut 10% of costs add to profit and bonus.

And the engineers didnt wake up smart knowing the rebar design, or structural requirements for a column.  They were taught or shown.  No different from formers or rebar crew.  Just one has aring and gives drawingts.

 

[revrnd]

Dealing w/ mechanical engineers we gave up arguing w/ them & built to print. After a couple of days in use the tooling would be back in the shop for repair due to "underbuilding".

[ArcticCrusher]

16 hours ago, Stoney said:

Do you wear one of the magical Eng. rings, Puzzleboy!

Mine is beside my wedding band.  Real engineers can't wear them.

[ArcticCrusher]

14 hours ago, Sksman said:

Believe what you want.  Many builders can form a bridge beam or parking garage form without an engineer design.  Yes they may have learned from a drawing initially.  Yes rebar crew follows a drawing.  But how many times do you think they need to do before they are pretty competent builders?  They are not all idiots looking to skimp a dollar of steel or concrete.  In fact most would overbuild as the longer they work, more they are paid.  In actual fact design engineers would be skimpers for their bonus on project.  Cut 10% of costs add to profit and bonus.

And the engineers didnt wake up smart knowing the rebar design, or structural requirements for a column.  They were taught or shown.  No different from formers or rebar crew.  Just one has aring and gives drawingts.

 

Unfortunately most waste their talents in management or some other role and never do any real engineering.  I have worked with many who are hands on in the field, likely less than 5% of the number who wear the ring.

[Puzzleboy]

Where did I say that builders were incompetent or idiots?  Builders specialize in constructing, Engineers specialize in design.  That's all I said!

And everybody needs to learn their craft/trade...... the Engineers, and the builders.  Intelligence and education are two different things. 

 

16 hours ago, Sksman said:

Believe what you want.  Many builders can form a bridge beam or parking garage form without an engineer design.  Yes they may have learned from a drawing initially.  Yes rebar crew follows a drawing.  But how many times do you think they need to do before they are pretty competent builders?  They are not all idiots looking to skimp a dollar of steel or concrete.  In fact most would overbuild as the longer they work, more they are paid.  In actual fact design engineers would be skimpers for their bonus on project.  Cut 10% of costs add to profit and bonus.

And the engineers didnt wake up smart knowing the rebar design, or structural requirements for a column.  They were taught or shown.  No different from formers or rebar crew.  Just one has aring and gives drawingts.

 

[Puzzleboy]

Those are for average engineers, Stoney.  

Plus, the iron ring kept slipping off my pecker....

 

17 hours ago, Stoney said:

Do you wear one of the magical Eng. rings, Puzzleboy!

Edited December 3, 2016 by Puzzleboy

[Stoney]

1 hour ago, Puzzleboy said:

Those are for average engineers, Stoney.  

Plus, the iron ring kept slipping off my pecker....

 

So your saying you have one.....

Not familiar with the small issue....

[ArcticCrusher]

1 hour ago, Puzzleboy said:

Those are for average engineers, Stoney.  

Plus, the iron ring kept slipping off my pecker....

 

Can't see that even at it's limpest point.

[Momorider]

APlus are total fuckups on every job they do  

[revrnd]

Anyone have experience w/ this outfit:

http://ambashiengineering.ca/

They were in charge of the Hwy 28 resurfacing south of Apsley this year.