01mxz800 Posted November 20, 2023 Share Posted November 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, Mag6240 said: Yeah, not sure of the shape of your posts, ours are the small fiberglass type, so a good 5/8" spike makes a perfect sized hole, that is snug when the post is pushed in. ours are 2'x1.5' hardwood stakes "t" post makes perfect pilot holes, only need to make pilot holes in a couple places, most posts drive right in with ease 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 20, 2023 Share Posted November 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, Mag6240 said: I've found that upwards of an inch of frozen turf, with my weight, a jump or two and shoooop, right to the cross members. Like I said, no more pounding posts for this guy... Some of those days were miserable. Our official trail marking is in a couple weeks. Probably going to make a couple of them up. We also run down a couple well traveled lanes that are hard to get the signs in. That would help there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 20, 2023 Share Posted November 20, 2023 14 minutes ago, X2700 said: we use small square metal stakes.unless ground frozen good they drive in pretty easy.We do carry drill and bit if we run into some hard ground and quick pre-drill hole. this is first year we could actually just push stakes in by hand in some plowed fields! Same here ... I think the stakes are 5/8" square, steal tubing? They pound in really well, unless it's hard as a rock. And also the same as you do, we have a drill in each of our SxS's to use, if needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 20, 2023 Share Posted November 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, 01mxz800 said: ours are 2'x1.5' hardwood stakes "t" post makes perfect pilot holes, only need to make pilot holes in a couple places, most posts drive right in with ease We use conduit and flatten one end so the signs don't turn. Club member is a electrical contractor and saves all his drops plus his supplier donates any damaged conduit they have to the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 20, 2023 Share Posted November 20, 2023 Some guys take care of their own section and signs. On our official trail marking day our signs are separated by bins to sections. On the day of marking we send out crews to do each section. Of course we also make signs as needed while marking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Blackstar Posted November 20, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted November 20, 2023 Interesting read. I've only been staking a handful of times, but here in Ontario, the rules are pretty cut and dry. All stakes must be made of soft wood. We use 2"x2" stakes 4' long. They must be painted in Flourescent orange and marked with reflectors at the top. The only place you are allowed to use steel stakes is at road crossing. The thought is that wood stakes will snap off easier causing less damage if a sled runs into it. Steel is only for Stop and Stop Ahead signs. Caution signs were outlawed years ago due to the court cases. Apparently, hanging a caution sign means that the club is acknowledging a hazard or problem with the trail. Don't hang the caution sign and there is no problem. Same goes for directional arrow signs. There is a manual with specific dimensions for stake placement, trail width and distance between stakes. Even with all this, there are still differences in how each club stakes and signs its trails. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mag6240 Posted November 21, 2023 Author Share Posted November 21, 2023 15 hours ago, Blackstar said: Caution signs were outlawed years ago due to the court cases. Apparently, hanging a caution sign means that the club is acknowledging a hazard or problem with the trail. Don't hang the caution sign and there is no problem. Same goes for directional arrow signs. This was discussed at the MN USA Fall Workshop - don’t put a caution out unless the specific issue or hazard is called out on the sign. Same reason, lawyers and court cases. 15 hours ago, Doug said: Some guys take care of their own section and signs. On our official trail marking day our signs are separated by bins to sections. On the day of marking we send out crews to do each section. Of course we also make signs as needed while marking. We have “trail captains” who are responsible for their signs and sections of trail - I have 5 myself and keep those signs separated. Just makes it so much easier the next year to resign as long as there aren’t too many reroutes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X2700 Posted November 21, 2023 Share Posted November 21, 2023 4 hours ago, Mag6240 said: This was discussed at the MN USA Fall Workshop - don’t put a caution out unless the specific issue or hazard is called out on the sign. Same reason, lawyers and court cases. We have “trail captains” who are responsible for their signs and sections of trail - I have 5 myself and keep those signs separated. Just makes it so much easier the next year to resign as long as there aren’t too many reroutes. Our president was at region 5 meeting last week and there was no mention of caution signs? Are they going to let clubs know about this?we have a lot of caution signs out there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 21, 2023 Share Posted November 21, 2023 Just now, X2700 said: Our president was at region 5 meeting last week and there was no mention of caution signs? Are they going to let clubs know about this?we have a lot of caution signs out there? If you guys received the MNUSA "Newsledder" a couple weeks ago, there was a video and a PDF presentation on trail signing. I went back to look at it, and there wasn't any mention of the new caution sign usage. It makes sense, but I don't see anything in that material to say it's the new requirement? We're too far into trail marking now to make changes, but maybe that will be the new thing for 2024-2025. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X2700 Posted November 21, 2023 Share Posted November 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Bontz said: If you guys received the MNUSA "Newsledder" a couple weeks ago, there was a video and a PDF presentation on trail signing. I went back to look at it, and there wasn't any mention of the new caution sign usage. It makes sense, but I don't see anything in that material to say it's the new requirement? We're too far into trail marking now to make changes, but maybe that will be the new thing for 2024-2025. I mentioned it to president and he said state better start making new caution signs or we ain’t changing! crazy we even have to discuss this!! I see caution sign I’m slowing down and looking for what’s up!!!!im sick of having to change for dumbasses!! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 21, 2023 Share Posted November 21, 2023 3 minutes ago, X2700 said: I mentioned it to president and he said state better start making new caution signs or we ain’t changing! crazy we even have to discuss this!! I see caution sign I’m slowing down and looking for what’s up!!!!im sick of having to change for dumbasses!! Just had an email exchange between our club officers, and we're doing the same thing ..... which is, marking as we always have. I agree that it's crazy we have to worry about lawyers and ambulance chasers coming after the club for trying to be safe. Like you, I see a caution sign and I'm off the gas and slowing down. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mag6240 Posted November 21, 2023 Author Share Posted November 21, 2023 10 minutes ago, Bontz said: Just had an email exchange between our club officers, and we're doing the same thing ..... which is, marking as we always have. I agree that it's crazy we have to worry about lawyers and ambulance chasers coming after the club for trying to be safe. Like you, I see a caution sign and I'm off the gas and slowing down. Yeah I agree with you guys - I’m not sure they have formally made it a change of a requirement now that you brought up that MNUSA email, I looked at it again as well. Perhaps the discussion I heard was more along the lines of a pending law suit, and how it may change going forward. Totally agree at this point, a lot of signs are already out there, those won’t be changing. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 21, 2023 Share Posted November 21, 2023 Reached out to our Alliance VP to see if he heard anything at the workshop on cautions signs for marking in Wisconsin and he said nothing was brought up. We try to be descriptive when we have something coming on the trail IE "Dip Ahead" "Culvert ahead" "Sharp turn ahead". We'll use "Caution ahead" if your coming to a gate or fence opening and put blazers on each side of the opening. As others have said its common sense if you see "Caution" or Caution ahead" you slow down. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 Nice day to do some trail marking. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 We're heading out tomorrow ... gonna be a brisk day!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mag6240 Posted November 27, 2023 Author Share Posted November 27, 2023 10 minutes ago, Bontz said: We're heading out tomorrow ... gonna be a brisk day!! Yuck - and very hard ground! Be curious to know how far the frost has gone… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 3 minutes ago, Mag6240 said: Yuck - and very hard ground! Be curious to know how far the frost has gone… Around home Eastern central Wisconsin no frost yet. Up Nth East of Eagle River Thursday had about 2" 2-1/2" where I pounded a stake in. No snow cover at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 27, 2023 Share Posted November 27, 2023 19 minutes ago, Mag6240 said: Yuck - and very hard ground! Be curious to know how far the frost has gone… We're gonna find out, firsthand. The chisel plow fields won't be an issue, and I think for the most part the other fields won't be that bad either. But we have one section on the north end, towards the Red Wing club, where it's a water run area and that's damn near always rock hard. We'll have the drill with us though, so if it's too frozen up we have a way to break through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mag6240 Posted November 27, 2023 Author Share Posted November 27, 2023 Well good luck with that - last week busting up a beaver dam I was surprised how much the ground firmed up. Can only imagine after the last couple days it’s going to be even more. At least it’s firming up before it snows, always a good thing IMO! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted November 28, 2023 Share Posted November 28, 2023 I'm guessing we have close to 4" of frost here. It was 7° yesterday morning and this morning it's 4°. Hope it goes good for you @Bontz. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 28, 2023 Share Posted November 28, 2023 8 hours ago, Sled_Hed said: I'm guessing we have close to 4" of frost here. It was 7° yesterday morning and this morning it's 4°. Hope it goes good for you @Bontz. Just got home, and all I can say is .... I wish we could've gotten out sooner!! LOL It was about 50/50 as far as pounding signs that would go right in vs. others that had to get through a couple inches of frost. But we got a bunch done today and that's the main thing. We're scheduled to have more people together on Saturday to finish it up, so I hope we have a good crew and can get through what's left in a short period of time. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted November 28, 2023 Share Posted November 28, 2023 1 hour ago, Bontz said: Just got home, and all I can say is .... I wish we could've gotten out sooner!! LOL It was about 50/50 as far as pounding signs that would go right in vs. others that had to get through a couple inches of frost. But we got a bunch done today and that's the main thing. We're scheduled to have more people together on Saturday to finish it up, so I hope we have a good crew and can get through what's left in a short period of time. Sounds like a good day either way. Like I've mentioned before, I have utmost respect for you guys that have to stake and tear down across farm ground. Our clubs up here have very little of that, the only signing like that I did was swamps and that we didn't have to take down. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X2700 Posted November 28, 2023 Share Posted November 28, 2023 2 hours ago, Bontz said: Just got home, and all I can say is .... I wish we could've gotten out sooner!! LOL It was about 50/50 as far as pounding signs that would go right in vs. others that had to get through a couple inches of frost. But we got a bunch done today and that's the main thing. We're scheduled to have more people together on Saturday to finish it up, so I hope we have a good crew and can get through what's left in a short period of time. I went out and marked a bit this afternoon also. had couple spots that there was a good 6-7” of frost other spots couple inches. hope to finish up the end of week!! thanks for getting those trails marked up!! I’ll be headed that way as soon as conditions allow!! some of my favorite trails in your neck of the woods!! mighty zumbro had a little ice on it this afternoon!! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bontz Posted November 29, 2023 Share Posted November 29, 2023 You have some dandy trails in your neck of the woods, too, @X2700 ... can't wait for mother nature to cooperate for all of us!! You mention ice on the Zumbro .. I was shocked to see patchy ice on Pepin today, too! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted November 29, 2023 Share Posted November 29, 2023 19 minutes ago, X2700 said: I went out and marked a bit this afternoon also. had couple spots that there was a good 6-7” of frost other spots couple inches. hope to finish up the end of week!! thanks for getting those trails marked up!! I’ll be headed that way as soon as conditions allow!! some of my favorite trails in your neck of the woods!! mighty zumbro had a little ice on it this afternoon!! 16 minutes ago, Bontz said: You have some dandy trails in your neck of the woods, too, @X2700 ... can't wait for mother nature to cooperate for all of us!! You mention ice on the Zumbro .. I was shocked to see patchy ice on Pepin today, too! One of the resort guys here walked out 1/4 mile in the bay today and had 4-6" of ice. I was shocked. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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