Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 29 minutes ago, HSR said: The US has more shootings than any other civilized country in the entire world. Why?Is it the only country with mental health issues?Is it the only country with criminals? not true, not even on total gun deaths and nowhere near close on deaths per capita, which i think is a more meaningful number 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Steve753 Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 23 minutes ago, Tommcat said: not true, not even on total gun deaths and nowhere near close on deaths per capita, which i think is a more meaningful number Very true. Most mass shootings and gun violence in the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriftBusta Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 18 hours ago, Steve753 said: Well you informed me last night they were hostile. I never gave it any thought before! Well, yeah. Anyone who travels into Pakistan on a dirt bike is a fucking fool. And just because you weren’t killed, doesn’t mean it still wasn’t a foolish thing to do. Didn’t your brother-in-law almost die last trip? Tell class about that one, and I would still like to know what kind of helmet he was wearing that would cause an injury like that. 1 hour ago, Steve753 said: So let me get this straight. I'm Dr. Phil because my opinion differs from yours? Who are you? Dr.Oz? No, you’re Dr. Phil because you assign positions to people that they don’t have in the form of a veiled insult. Then you throw up the. Is it that means something. 1 hour ago, Steve753 said: Well if the gun wasn't there in the first place there wouldn’t be any accidental discharges now would there. Wow, you got it all figured out 1 hour ago, p51mstg said: This is not an argument. There's no way to make all guns disappear. As long as there are guns, someone will have them. Neil has nothing on this guy, Steve. He really enjoys being obtuse but he’s real “busy“ years ago my brother and I used to own a liquor store. There were two armed robberies in our area in which the shop owners were both shot dead. We started carrying at work and kept an AK 47 underneath the front counter, God help anybody who tried to rob us lol, those were crazy times 1 hour ago, HSR said: No and even if I was allowed to carry a handgun I couldn't be bothered. WTF would I need it for? Funny thing is , I betcha I've killed more things than 90% of the forum.If not more. Oooooohhh! Maybe 92%!? Who’s cooler than you? The good news is, you’re Canadian and we don’t give a fuck what you think. as long as the criminals have guns, the honest citizens are going to have guns too. It’s that pesky constitution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Steve753 Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, DriftBusta said: Well, yeah. Anyone who travels into Pakistan on a dirt bike is a fucking fool. And just because you weren’t killed, doesn’t mean it still wasn’t a foolish thing to do. Didn’t your brother-in-law almost die last trip? Tell class about that one, and I would still like to know what kind of helmet he was wearing that would cause an injury like that. No, you’re Dr. Phil because you assign positions to people that they don’t have in the form of a veiled insult. Then you throw up the. Is it that means something. Wow, you got it all figured out Neil has nothing on this guy, Steve. He really enjoys being obtuse but he’s real “busy“ years ago my brother and I used to own a liquor store. There were two armed robberies in our area in which the shop owners were both shot dead. We started carrying at work and kept an AK 47 underneath the front counter, God help anybody who tried to rob us lol, those were crazy times Oooooohhh! Maybe 92%!? Who’s cooler than you? The good news is, you’re Canadian and we don’t give a fuck what you think. as long as the criminals have guns, the honest citizens are going to have guns too. It’s that pesky constitution. Have to go watch my dock being put in. I'll discuss later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Bontz said: Why? So people who obtain them illegally can't get to them? That would be the only rationale I see. Law-abiding citizens, whether they own one gun or a one hundred, are not the problem. What about all the legal owners that don't properly store their weapons and get robbed? All guns start out as "legally" owned guns unless robbed from a gun store. Where do you think illegal handguns come from ,Santa? 1 hour ago, Tommcat said: not true, not even on total gun deaths and nowhere near close on deaths per capita, which i think is a more meaningful number Well other than these countries which I don't consider first world El Salvador; Venezuela; Guatemala; Colombia; Honduras; Brazil. Unless I'm missing some statistics the US leads the way in most categories. Especially school shootings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted June 23, 2023 Author Share Posted June 23, 2023 what's the count this week? I haven't looked in a while... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriftBusta Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Steve753 said: Have to go watch my dock being put in. I'll discuss later. No need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 54 minutes ago, HSR said: What about all the legal owners that don't properly store their weapons and get robbed? All guns start out as "legally" owned guns unless robbed from a gun store. Where do you think illegal handguns come from ,Santa? Well other than these countries which I don't consider first world El Salvador; Venezuela; Guatemala; Colombia; Honduras; Brazil. Unless I'm missing some statistics the US leads the way in most categories. Especially school shootings. You're definitely missing sime data. If i remember from last year, the US was top 5 in total gun deaths, but around 35 in per 100k citizens. Brazil is usually about 4 times higher. The only category we were 1st in was suicides by firearm. Not really sure what to make of that stat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 I already addressed Brazil, not really what I would call first world country. C'mon Tom to try an excuse what is going on in your country by relying on statistics isn't right. Until all of you admit there is a problem nothing is going to change,in fact things are going to get far worse before they get better. The staus quo isn't cutting it and it affects my country too as the US is the #1 supplier of illegal handguns here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, HSR said: What about all the legal owners that don't properly store their weapons and get robbed? All guns start out as "legally" owned guns unless robbed from a gun store. Where do you think illegal handguns come from ,Santa? The majority come from straw purchases. As in when someone who can buy a gun legaly buys one for someone who cant. And in many cases it is girlfriends of criminals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 25 minutes ago, steve from amherst said: The majority come from straw purchases. As in when someone who can buy a gun legaly buys one for someone who cant. And in many cases it is girlfriends of criminals Well then it sounds like a flaw in the system that needs to be addressed. It shows how easy criminals can get a gun.Can't just shrug your shoulders and so oh well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, HSR said: Well then it sounds like a flaw in the system that needs to be addressed. It shows how easy criminals can get a gun.Can't just shrug your shoulders and so oh well. It definatly is a flaw. Unfortunatly even thou doing so is a crime that can be given prison time. Very few are ever prosecuted for it. 'Straw-buyers' in illegal gun buys rarely prosecuted despite crackdown The GAO report said there were 112,000 firearms transactions denied in fiscal year 2017 because of false information on federal firearms purchase forms. The report stated those denials resulted in 12,700 cases investigated by Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms agents. But according to the GAO, only a handful of these cases went to court. "U.S. Attorney's Offices had prosecuted 12 of these cases as of June 2018," the GAO report stated. "Where we can prove the elements beyond a reasonable doubt, we're taking those cases," said Vipal Patel, Acting United States Attorney for the Southern District of Ohio since last March. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 An illegal firearm purchase (straw purchase) is a federal crime. An illegal firearm purchase can bring a felony conviction sentence of ten years in jail and a fine of up to $250,000. But when it is not enforced it is obviously ignored. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 How a liberal city deals with it. MADISON, Wis. (WMTV) - A man convicted of participating in the “straw purchase” of guns was described by the judge during sentencing as being involved in “gun culture.” The Western District Court of Wisconsin stated Wednesday that Isaiah Phillips will serve 60 days in jail, followed by three years of extended supervision. He pleaded guilty to aiding and abetting a false statement during the purchase of a firearm on March 14. Chief U.S. District Judge James Peterson explained the 60-day sentence was due to the 18-year-old Madison man’s non-compliance with pretrial supervision, saying he never had someone as defiant on pretrial supervision” as Phillips. The judge also described Phillips’ actions as irresponsible and his behaviors as both “self-destructive and dangerous to the community.” Fitchburg law enforcement officials launched an investigation on June 2, 2022, into illegal purchases of firearms, also known as “straw purchasing,” involving Phillips and two other people. The other individuals were not identified in the release. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 10 minutes ago, steve from amherst said: But when it is not enforced it is obviously ignored. Another flaw in the system then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 Just now, HSR said: Another flaw in the system then. Well we cant be picking on people of color, or the presidents son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 4 minutes ago, steve from amherst said: Well we cant be picking on people of color, or the presidents son. A vote getting politician's answers to a gun problem. Make more feel good vote getting gun laws that won't be enforced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, HSR said: I already addressed Brazil, not really what I would call first world country. C'mon Tom to try an excuse what is going on in your country by relying on statistics isn't right. Until all of you admit there is a problem nothing is going to change,in fact things are going to get far worse before they get better. The staus quo isn't cutting it and it affects my country too as the US is the #1 supplier of illegal handguns here. Gun laws simply aren't the answer, and you're over simplifying things. 2 of the countries with the most relaxed gun laws in the world are norway and Finland, neither even cracks the top 100 in gun violence. Its a people problem, not a lack of laws. Its already illegal to kill someone, how does making it more illegal help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 43 minutes ago, HSR said: Well then it sounds like a flaw in the system that needs to be addressed. It shows how easy criminals can get a gun.Can't just shrug your shoulders and so oh well. You could actually put them in prison after their first, second or even third violent crime or firearm felony, that would certainly be a step in the right direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 (edited) Here's a few examples of where politicians that are left sided are THE problem and not the solution. This is only 2 of the currently proposed legislations currently here right now, and show the differencein thinking. Pro 2a groups have proposed that if someone has a red flag law filed on them to seize their guns, mental health should be required and provided free of cost. The law should also apply to ANYONE suicidal or threatening, regardless of being a gun owner or not. The democrats fully oppose this. Anti 2a is proposing that anyone that has their guns stolen is prosecuted for whatever crimes are committed with those weapons. Edited June 23, 2023 by Tommcat 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 (edited) https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country Some interesting stats here, IFyou're interested in stats and not just repeating talking points Edited June 23, 2023 by Tommcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member Steve753 Posted June 23, 2023 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted June 23, 2023 13 minutes ago, Tommcat said: Gun laws simply aren't the answer, and you're over simplifying things. 2 of the countries with the most relaxed gun laws in the world are norway and Finland, neither even cracks the top 100 in gun violence. Its a people problem, not a lack of laws. Its already illegal to kill someone, how does making it more illegal help? Maybe handguns are the problem. Interestingly, European societies that come close to US rates of gun ownership, in terms of gun owners per 100 people, (but with hunting rifles and shotguns rather than handguns), such as Finland and Norway, are among the safest societies internationally with regards to gun violence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 Just now, Steve753 said: Maybe handguns are the problem. Interestingly, European societies that come close to US rates of gun ownership, in terms of gun owners per 100 people, (but with hunting rifles and shotguns rather than handguns), such as Finland and Norway, are among the safest societies internationally with regards to gun violence I wouldn't say any one gun is THE problem, but handguns are certainly used in the overwhelming majority of crimes. And yet the politicians are focused on a gun platform used in about .5% of violent crime. I dont get it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommcat Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 Here's an example of where the right is at fault. A current proposed law would require mandatory live fire training in order to get a concealed carry license. Our 2a group opposes it. Personally, i think the more training people get, the safer everyone is. I've taken a lot of advanced training classes and have nevernot come out a better and more competent shooter. So how is that a bad thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 17 minutes ago, Tommcat said: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country Some interesting stats here, IFyou're interested in stats and not just repeating talking points I'll check it out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.