Biden sends 1000’s of formally high paid tradesman and union workers to the soup line

[Zambroski]

16 minutes ago, revkevsdi said:

Might as well rip off the bandage fast. The oil industry is on the decline. 
I know Trump still has you living in the coal mines but the future is green.  

Just dumb as fuck and once again, shows your lack of understanding about economic issues is on par with your expertise on everything else.

4 minutes ago, BOHICA said:

I’m the only one with a plug-in vehicle of any sorts on this forum currently.  I’m the only with a a plug in pickup on order of any sorts.  I go into the city on Friday to get my permits for my DIY Solar for my trot top array that I will likely/hopefully get started on.
 

 

Also I’m not a person that produces styrofoam for a living but do understand that people will still use it despite it destruction it causes the enviroment....  much like the oil from Canada that would get sent in the pipeline is still going to get used.  It’s will ultimately produce more carbon releases into the enviroment now though then it would have in the pipeline

 like a big dog!  Well done!

[BOHICA]

4 minutes ago, Zambroski said:

Just dumb as fuck and once again, shows your lack of understanding about economic issues is on par with your expertise on everything else.

 like a big dog!  Well done!

Solar is going to cover 100% of my needs plus transportation cost for 2 full EV’s. Over building my current needs to account for transportation of 2 full EV’s added over the next couple years

Edited January 21, 2021 by BOHICA

[revkevsdi]

1 minute ago, BOHICA said:

Solar is going to cover 100% of my needs plus transportation cost for to full EV’s. Over building my current needs to account for transportation.

Wow!  Very impressive. 

[Zambroski]

1 minute ago, BOHICA said:

Solar is going to cover 100% of my needs plus transportation cost for to full EV’s. Over building my current needs to account for transportation.

See, but for the libtwats like Kayak Karen, walking the proverbial walk on his own chosen ideology doesn't matter.  It's about you voting the way she wants.  Hypocrisy is their cry....HEAR THEM ROAR!!!!!

[BOHICA]

4 minutes ago, revkevsdi said:

Wow!  Very impressive. 

I have room for another 4-5 kw if need be.  Which may happen down the road...  I could change my hot water from natural gas to tankless electric and maybe add some electric heat as well to slow the furnace up in the winter.  Will always cook on natural gas no matter what. Going to put 2 EV’s in the garage and see how close my math and my Solar array designer/engineering is on my needs on my useage at that point and add if needed

[jdsky]

58 minutes ago, Mainecat said:

I’m a clueless fuck.

 

Finally a you posted something I can agree with.

[Doomxz600]

9 minutes ago, BOHICA said:

I have room for another 4-5 kw if need be.  Which may happen down the road...  I could change my hot water from natural gas to tankless electric and maybe add some electric heat as well to slow the furnace up in the winter.  Will always cook on natural gas no matter what. Going to put 2 EV’s in the garage and see how close my math and my Solar array designer/engineering is on my needs on my useage at that point and add if needed

You know whats fun about solar ? Well when national grid was required to connect your off the grid set up they had to absorb the cost. So when your system cannot support you and you have to buy power back they can charge you any rate they choose and won that in court LOL. The libs are going nuts about that now. Thing about solar is if you remove all local,state and fed money it fails the next day.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Doomxz600

[Zambroski]

2 minutes ago, jdsky said:

 

Finally a you posted something I can agree with.

x2

 

[revkevsdi]

7 minutes ago, BOHICA said:

I have room for another 4-5 kw if need be.  Which may happen down the road...  I could change my hot water from natural gas to tankless electric and maybe add some electric heat as well to slow the furnace up in the winter.  Will always cook on natural gas no matter what. Going to put 2 EV’s in the garage and see how close my math and my Solar array designer/engineering is on my needs on my useage at that point and add if needed

So you are almost completely off the grid?  That is really impressive. 
 

The former ambassador to the US was on CBC today and put it bluntly that oil is not the future. The largest capitalized business is Tesla and the other automakers are following suit. He was letting people know that what you are doing is the future. 

[BOHICA]

2 minutes ago, Doomxz600 said:

You know whats fun about solar ? Well when national grid was required to connect your off the grid set up they had to absorb the cost. So when your system cannot support you and you have to buy power back they can charge you any rate they choose and won that in court LOL. The libs are going nut about that now. Thing about solar is if you remove all local,state and fed money it fails the next day.

My utility is a 1 for 1 on grid tie.  No payout for excess.  Works out great.  Produce all day and pull back the free power at night.  6-8 years my area is projected to be short on peak needs... it’s pretty challenging to get big transmission lines built from central generation facilities.  Land owners and enviromental pretty much squash it most of the time.  That is why I think all green subsidies should go to homeowners and small business if the do onsite green energy.  Utility scale is  subsidies just are not effective

[revkevsdi]

6 minutes ago, Doomxz600 said:

You know whats fun about solar ? Well when national grid was required to connect your off the grid set up they had to absorb the cost. So when your system cannot support you and you have to buy power back they can charge you any rate they choose and won that in court LOL. The libs are going nuts about that now. Thing about solar is if you remove all local,state and fed money it fails the next day.

If that becomes an issue the Biden administration will be able to address it without obstructionist Republicans standing in the way. 

[Zambroski]

4 minutes ago, revkevsdi said:

If that becomes an issue the Biden administration will be able to address it without obstructionist Republicans standing in the way. 

Jesus Chirst you are an idiot.  But enough about that.  My curious mind wants to know how far "off grid" you have gone to walk your own walk (We'll save pollution for another thread).  Is it like Tools?  Where you are both just "planning" to buy an EV vehicle sometime in the future?  I'm sure you both have a recycle bin where some of your plastics go...so way to go on that!

[jdsky]

29 minutes ago, BOHICA said:

I’m the only one with a plug-in vehicle of any sorts on this forum currently.  I’m the only with a plug in pickup on order of any sorts.  I go into the city on Friday to get my permits for my DIY Solar for my roof top array that I will likely/hopefully get started on.

Solar is complete bullshit in our part of the planet.  We have one dumbass in the neighborhood that installed a few panels on the roof.  Not enough sun here to even come close to making the math remotely work.  I installed a geothermal heat pump 5 years ago but only because my builder grade furnace shit the bed and with tax incentives the cost was nearly equivalent to a conventional system. 

At the same time I had the "experts" do the calculations for enough solar to power the heat pump and everything else.  Total cost for enough panels to achieve this and with the tax incentives at the time was still $50K out of pocket.  My electric bill, even with the heat pump, averages $2500/year.  An elementary school kid can figure out it was going to take at least 20 years to pay for this massive solar array standing in my yard.  Yes, the yard because there was nowhere near enough room on the roof to hold all the panels that would be needed.  That's considering zero maintenance costs over that same time frame.  So while everyone back in the 70's was saying solar is the future they were right.  It's still somewhere out in the future.   

 

[teamgreen02]

6 minutes ago, jdsky said:

Solar is complete bullshit in our part of the planet.  We have one dumbass in the neighborhood that installed a few panels on the roof.  Not enough sun here to even come close to making the math remotely work.  I installed a geothermal heat pump 5 years ago but only because my builder grade furnace shit the bed and with tax incentives the cost was nearly equivalent to a conventional system. 

At the same time I had the "experts" do the calculations for enough solar to power the heat pump and everything else.  Total cost for enough panels to achieve this and with the tax incentives at the time was still $50K out of pocket.  My electric bill, even with the heat pump, averages $2500/year.  An elementary school kid can figure out it was going to take at least 20 years to pay for this massive solar array standing in my yard.  Yes, the yard because there was nowhere near enough room on the roof to hold all the panels that would be needed.  That's considering zero maintenance costs over that same time frame.  So while everyone back in the 70's was saying solar is the future they were right.  It's still somewhere out in the future.   

 

Yep, this is exactly why it doesn't make sense to install solar.  Our electric bill is probably under $2000 a year.  $20k for a system makes my money back in 10 years?  Just go install some LEDs and blow in some insulation in your attic.

It's a pretty simple math equation, payback = investment / (savings + credits).  For the left they will continue to push up the savings through increased electric rates and credits via redistribution in Washington.  The investment will come down, as it always does for technology, but the left can't control that.

I took a renewable energies course in college, that must have been around 2008.  Even then it didn't make sense unless there were credits and the rates were sky high ($0.20+/kWh).  In a previous life I used to do energy auditing.  I still remember the business owner who had 400 watt metal halides all over the warehouse that wanted to put solar panels on the roof.  

[Zambroski]

4 minutes ago, teamgreen02 said:

Yep, this is exactly why it doesn't make sense to install solar.  Our electric bill is probably under $2000 a year.  $20k for a system makes my money back in 10 years?  Just go install some LEDs and blow in some insulation in your attic.

It's a pretty simple math equation, payback = investment / (savings + credits).  For the left they will continue to push up the savings through increased electric rates and credits via redistribution in Washington.  The investment will come down, as it always does for technology, but the left can't control that.

I took a renewable energies course in college, that must have been around 2008.  Even then it didn't make sense unless there were credits and the rates were sky high ($0.20+/kWh).  In a previous life I used to do energy auditing.  I still remember the business owner who had 400 watt metal halides all over the warehouse that wanted to put solar panels on the roof.  

I've posted it here and on HCS about what I tried to do when I built my last house.  Had a quote for all solar to go off grid.  All said and done, it made ZERO sense financially and by the time the ROI was going to be coming around the corner, needed maintenance was going to gobble it all up in a hurry (if it hasn't already nickel-dimed me along the way).  I mean, the numbers weren't even remotely close to making any financial sense at all.  None.  Not even with tax subsidies and selling power back to the E company.

Until the technology get's cheaper/more efficient, it's only because somebody wants to be off grid or absolutely needs to be that it is a sensible endeavor.

[low-1]

Solar is great for residential, but still relies heavily on subsidies and incentives to be economically feasible.  It can not work for industrial unless we COMPLETELY change how we operate as a society.  It just can't.

And I can't get over how fixed it is in a lot of people's minds that oil = burning it for transportation and power.  We are 100% completely married to oil, there is no way around it.  Look at 90% of the things you wear, the stuff in your house, the plastics on your electric vehicle, the insulation on the wiring from your solar panel to your charge controller, printed circuit boards, fertilizer for agriculture, medication... the list is literally endless.  Anyone who things we can end our relationship with oil is an idiot, pure and simple.

[teamgreen02]

2 minutes ago, low-1 said:

Solar is great for residential, but still relies heavily on subsidies and incentives to be economically feasible.  It can not work for industrial unless we COMPLETELY change how we operate as a society.  It just can't.

And I can't get over how fixed it is in a lot of people's minds that oil = burning it for transportation and power.  We are 100% completely married to oil, there is no way around it.  Look at 90% of the things you wear, the stuff in your house, the plastics on your electric vehicle, the insulation on the wiring from your solar panel to your charge controller, printed circuit boards, fertilizer for agriculture, medication... the list is literally endless.  Anyone who things we can end our relationship with oil is an idiot, pure and simple.

Some idiot will be along shortly to type out a response on a plastic keyboard to tell you how wrong you are.

[Zambroski]

4 minutes ago, low-1 said:

Solar is great for residential, but still relies heavily on subsidies and incentives to be economically feasible.  It can not work for industrial unless we COMPLETELY change how we operate as a society.  It just can't.

And I can't get over how fixed it is in a lot of people's minds that oil = burning it for transportation and power.  We are 100% completely married to oil, there is no way around it.  Look at 90% of the things you wear, the stuff in your house, the plastics on your electric vehicle, the insulation on the wiring from your solar panel to your charge controller, printed circuit boards, fertilizer for agriculture, medication... the list is literally endless.  Anyone who things we can end our relationship with oil is an idiot, pure and simple.

RIght on the head.

2 minutes ago, teamgreen02 said:

Some idiot will be along shortly to type out a response on a plastic keyboard to tell you how wrong you are.

I can't wait.  They are so entertaining!   

[Ez ryder]

1 hour ago, Mainecat said:

Translations: I’m a clueless fuck.

well the translation is the oil is getting to TX some how . and right now all the over flow is shipped in Buffets trains will continue to be shipped in buffets trains especially seeing as the pipe line is approved to go to one of warrens rail yards at this point .

so I ask again how much do the state get that buffets rails run though? 

[Ez ryder]

2 hours ago, Mainecat said:

Jesus your a dumb ass.

so what your saying is that chicken drinks are rebar.

what are you saying of the millions and millions of miles of burred pipeline transporting petroleum products in north America this one is the one we all need to fear because it is so diff than the other millions of miles of burred pipeline that currently exist?  no reason to replace aging infrastructure oh wait that cant be what you think or is it     

Edited January 21, 2021 by Ez ryder

[low-1]

8 minutes ago, Ez ryder said:

well the translation is the oil is getting to TX some how . and right now all the over flow is shipped in Buffets trains will continue to be shipped in buffets trains especially seeing as the pipe line is approved to go to one of warrens rail yards at this point .

so I ask again how much do the state get that buffets rails run though? 

Right?  That's the other part of it.  "If we cancel the pipeline, we will stop the oil".  No, it'll keep moving... in tanker cars that dribble along continuously as they go, that are powered by diesel locomotives, that are lubricated with oil, that occasionally derail and cause a mess.  Or it'll go in tanker trucks, which are significantly less efficient and have all of the same problems x 100.  Move a pile of oil efficiently in a well constructed pipe, or more the same amount inefficiently all over the countryside.  EVERY method of moving it around has problems and causes significant environmental damage.  The media just chooses to focus on pipeline spills.  Don't get me wrong, any type of spill isn't a good thing.  But concentrated in one spot or spread across thousands of miles, I'd be willing to bet the pipeline spills release far less to the environment overall than the alternatives...

Which brings me back to why don't we refine it right at the source, rather than unnecessarily moving it around so much?

Edited January 21, 2021 by low-1

[Ez ryder]

1 minute ago, low-1 said:

Right?  That's the other part of it.  "If we cancel the pipeline, we will stop the oil".  No, it'll keep moving... in tankers cars that dribble along continuously as they go, that are powered by diesel locomotives, that are lubricated with oil, that occasionally derail and cause a mess.  Or it'll go in tanker trucks, which are significantly less efficient and have all of the same problems x 100.  Move a pile of oil efficiently in a well constructed pipe, or more the same amount inefficiently all over the countryside.  EVERY method of moving it around has problems and causes significant environmental damage.  The media just chooses to focus on pipeline spills.  Don't get me wrong, any type of spill isn't a good thing.  But concentrated in one spot or spread across thousands of miles, I'd be willing to bet the pipeline spills release far less to the environment overall than the alternatives...

Which brings me back to why don't we refine it right at the source, rather than unnecessarily moving it around so much?

agree we need more refinery's but good fucking luck getting one of those built in north america today . zero chance 

[BOHICA]

My Republican Run state also has 100% tax deduction on the system spread over 4 years.  Financially if you can afford the up front cost have tax obligations it makes total sense for me 

all my solar will have a 25 year warranty

my electric bill last year was $1814.37
my pack back is just under 10 years...  if I would build a system to meet my needs my payback would be 8.8 years.

If I potential factor in an ev as that is what I am build to capacity wise at $2.50 a gallon in gas on an average of 20 mpg over 10,000 I eliminate $1250 a year in gas.

when we get rid of the Wife’s phev suv at 40 mpg and her 16000 miles a year I eliminate another $1000 in gas a year.

 

my payback is going to be quick and it will be nice to eliminate several $1000’s a year in expenses especially in retirement in 15 years!

Edited January 21, 2021 by BOHICA

[Doomxz600]

52 minutes ago, revkevsdi said:

If that becomes an issue the Biden administration will be able to address it without obstructionist Republicans standing in the way. 

It's a public utility and regulated for the sale of electricity. Now when someone goes off the so called grid and forces the utility to buy power back the utility can change whatever rate they please for the electricity when needed. It went to court and the result was a complete shock to all the eco freaks. 

 It gets really funny when their system is down for a long time. It's nobody's problem but there's to fix. 

[low-1]

And that's great.  As I said, it can work for residential.  But you even said that you have 100% tax deduction on it spread over 4 years.  Without that incentive, does it look as attractive?  And panels age and wear out, charge controllers fail, transfer switches fail, if you run a battery backup, those need replacement.