f7ben Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Just now, ArcticCrusher said: I don't doubt that for a second right now and I know the limitations of current instrumentation. It will come but its not there yet.....and its going to take a lot of maintenance staff to keep this stuff running Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Platinum Contributing Member steve from amherst Posted March 28, 2018 Platinum Contributing Member Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Momorider said: Cable is steel wire its used in reinforced concrete pressure pipe probably lots of stuff Ah , didn't think of that. Correct it is everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, f7ben said: It will come but its not there yet.....and its going to take a lot of maintenance staff to keep this stuff running Yes it will and I think we are still quite away's from AI replacing humans. However when AI can replace Consuela, you know the shit is getting real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mileage Psycho Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, f7ben said: Automation will eventually replace everyone.....singling out the steel industry is idiotic. I work in a 25 year old mini-mill producing nearly 4 million tons of steel annually. Its not state of the art but it is 1000x more automated than the old integrated mills. It takes roughly 1000 employees to run the site and add in another 800-1000 contractors to support it. To claim that even the grounds crew could be run by 14 people is the dumbest thing I have ever fucking heard. We run lean crews and every person works hard to keep things running.....we have tried automating things like cranes that make repetitive picks before and you end up with more downtime and people trying to keep them running than you do a traditional crane. You claim to be smart at math, do the math Face it you are in a dinosaur of a plant, think about the future Quote Like the coal industry, the steel industry has gone through rapid changes over the last ten years. While there's no doubt steel will continue to be a crucial part of many people's daily lives, the question remains if any of those people will be involved in making that steel. Bloomberg takes a look at the Austrian steel industry, including a plant that needs just 14 employees to make 500,000 tons of robust steel wire a year. 1 hour ago, f7ben said: Curious.....if you guys think we can automate and entire steel plant eliminating 95% of positions.......what industry cant we automate to the same extent? This is a retarded fucking argument and I expect no honest answers I really can't think of one, it's just a matter of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Just now, Mileage Psycho said: You claim to be smart at math, do the math Face it you are in a dinosaur of a plant, think about the future I really can't think of one, it's just a matter of time. So you and I should just quit our jobs and hope to get hired at starbucks .....is that your advice? I'm in a dinosaur of a plant Vince.....and that plant is profiting over a million dollars a day currently Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mileage Psycho Posted March 28, 2018 Author Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, f7ben said: So you and I should just quit our jobs and hope to get hired at starbucks .....is that your advice? I'm in a dinosaur of a plant Vince.....and that plant is profiting over a million dollars a day currently Think of your future Think!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Just now, Mileage Psycho said: Think of your future Think!! I'm a fucking maintenance and controls electrician with considerable PLC and Instrumentation experience who is better placed to move into an automated future than me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 2 hours ago, f7ben said: I'm a fucking maintenance and controls electrician with considerable PLC and Instrumentation experience who is better placed to move into an automated future than me? Does Vince even wire in instrumentation and controls or hazardous areas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f7ben Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 21 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said: Does Vince even wire in instrumentation and controls or hazardous areas? Vince is a very experienced electrical contractor although I'm not sure of what his industrial or process background might be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 5 hours ago, Mileage Psycho said: This vision our President has of the country going back to 1950's type of manufacturing is delusional, there is no turning back the clock and don't look now but the 20's are right around the corner Those steel jobs are $550k per year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, f7ben said: Vince is a very experienced electrical contractor although I'm not sure of what his industrial or process background might be. That means nothing unless you work in that field constantly. Half my bus over the past few years has been in C1Div1 or C2Div1 Areas, ain't gonna take the next IBrew Bro into the field and do live checks. Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 12 minutes ago, spin_dry said: Those steel jobs are $550k per year You should apply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Just now, ArcticCrusher said: You should apply. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 1 minute ago, spin_dry said: Why? Who the fuck is gonna pay you 550K per year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spin_dry Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Just now, ArcticCrusher said: Who the fuck is gonna pay you 550K per year? I could never fit a $2.6666whatever million house up my ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 8 minutes ago, spin_dry said: I could never fit a $2.6666whatever million house up my ass. I could, no problem, just needs a little push. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledderj Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 1 hour ago, ArcticCrusher said: That means nothing unless you work in that field constantly. Half my bus over the past few years has been in C1Div1 or C2Div1 Areas, ain't gonna take the next IBrew Bro into the field and do live checks. Lol. If you are hanging with IBEW bros, can you even pick up a screw driver? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 7 hours ago, sledderj said: If you are hanging with IBEW bros, can you even pick up a screw driver? I could help them out and show them where to land their meter leads, but hey we're paid by the hour and want to see something that should take two days to complete stretched to over a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledderj Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 We do work in a couple unionized plants and as long as they didn't see you as an asshole or a threat to their work, they were pretty accommodating. Most of the time we are doing work they don't want to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticCrusher Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 3 minutes ago, sledderj said: We do work in a couple unionized plants and as long as they didn't see you as an asshole or a threat to their work, they were pretty accommodating. Most of the time we are doing work they don't want to do. Most of our work is new installs or upgrades to existing process equipment. On the later, there are tighter schedules, most are pretty good and just want to get things going to meet schedules. The best unions are the ones you don't even know exist and that is pretty much the norm. If most are unfamiliar with new instrumentation they will gladly let you take charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anler Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 15 hours ago, f7ben said: I'm a fucking maintenance and controls electrician with considerable PLC and Instrumentation experience who is better placed to move into an automated future than me? And you ride Arctic cats. You are NOT very evolved! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
favoritos Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 This stuff is closer than most realize. I decommissioned a facility with 72 EEs. They were mostly replaced by machines. Some new jobs were created. They were all in technical control processes and programming. Ironically, the jobs that remained for the most part were related to dealing with regulatory processes. In some ways the government does create jobs. Some of that paperwork is still on handwritten forms. Seems crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmo Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 I walked into a new job site one day, plugged in my computer and cable to the system I was working on and all the IBEW guys walked off the job because I was a non union guy “running wires”. The union steward guy showed up, chuckled, and told the boys to get back to work. Someone was looking for an excuse not to work that day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USA Contributing Member $poorsledder$ Posted March 29, 2018 USA Contributing Member Share Posted March 29, 2018 20 hours ago, ArcticCrusher said: Whatever can will be. Just look at the past 25 years with vision systems and pick and place systems we never thought could be handled by non human hands. Now they are a dime a dozen. I worked for a small American company that did semiautomatic through hole and pick and place machines. A lot of work went into that that equipment, a lot of cool technology from the vision system, motors & drives, motion system..... was cool to get the thing together and then "dialed in" to run all day. Did this equipment take away jobs? Sure, but there were still people needed to keep the thing running, move things around, etc.. Some of what this technology did couldn't be done by people (fine pitch part placement / soldering). I can see automation put in place in more and more environments but there still has to be people on site to keep the things running. You may take a couple out of the picture but you need people to maintain the equipment and do setups, loading, etc... Need qualified people so some idiot like Mainecat with his "screwdriver and hammer" doesn't make things worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sledderj Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Makes you wonder what happens when automation hits China and India. Lots of the repetitive assembly line stuff is done there. When automation gets cheaper than what even the millions of them can do it for, then shit will really hit the fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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