Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 (edited) as far as the sleds we ride currently I'm going to go with Snocross racing which is where standup and rider forward first took hold thanks to Blair Morgan and folks with a motocross background. taller lugged tracks, long travel suspension and shocks advanced from cross country racing (yes, XC played another large part) and I'd agree the REV was the first game changer with Blair. but, things have changed within the sport and after reading the article with Beavis about the catalyst the other day I wonder if we're going to see less development come from the racing side down the road and focus more from the off trail and mountain side of the sport, which I'm less familiar with. the old Cat, in my opinion would have had Team Arctic racing on the new chassis this weekend, which they are not and makes me wonder if Cat is the only manufacturer that may be doing this down the road. Flame away 😂 Edited December 16, 2022 by Crnr2Crnr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnstang Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 Motocross/dirt bikes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not greg b Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 19 minutes ago, mnstang said: Motocross/dirt bikes. 100% this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 27 minutes ago, mnstang said: Motocross/dirt bikes. not disagreeing, so where are we heading? don't say snowbikes... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not greg b Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 6 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: not disagreeing, so where are we heading? don't say snowbikes... not snow bikes. Look how much a mx bike has changed in the last 10 years. Not a whole lot. I think we will see a lot of gadgets and gizmos come around but the basic design of the sleds will be same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 4 minutes ago, Not greg b said: not snow bikes. Look how much a mx bike has changed in the last 10 years. Not a whole lot. I think we will see a lot of gadgets and gizmos come around but the basic design of the sleds will be same. probably, but more off trail focused imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not greg b Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 21 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: probably, but more off trail focused imo I think that has peaked and they are shifting back towards the trail market as they have have ignored it for a while. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 1 minute ago, Not greg b said: I think that has peaked and they are shifting back towards the trail market as they have have ignored it for a while. I have concerns about us still actually having trails down the road... not enough young people involved, new land owners, inconsiderate riders who can't be respectful to private property owners that allow us to legally trespass upon their property, etc. Maybe I should move to Alaska, I've been hearing great things lately. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 8 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: I have concerns about us still actually having trails down the road... not enough young people involved, new land owners, inconsiderate riders who can't be respectful to private property owners that allow us to legally trespass upon their property, etc. Maybe I should move to Alaska, I've been hearing great things lately. True! There is only 300 miles of trails to worry about losing! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not greg b Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 27 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: I have concerns about us still actually having trails down the road... not enough young people involved, new land owners, inconsiderate riders who can't be respectful to private property owners that allow us to legally trespass upon their property, etc. Maybe I should move to Alaska, I've been hearing great things lately. I think the off trail thing is close to getting shut down as fast as the trails. I know the locals in up are getting sick of the jack asses riding every where but where they should be 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 1 minute ago, Not greg b said: I think the off trail thing is close to getting shut down as fast as the trails. I know the locals in up are getting sick of the jack asses riding every where but where they should be keep explaining... as there are areas where it can be done legally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnstang Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 1 hour ago, Crnr2Crnr said: not disagreeing, so where are we heading? don't say snowbikes... Electric... But as far as the vehicle and chassis I'm not sure. I don't see drastic changes like how the Rev changed things but I think continued development focusing on better rider input and manipulation of the machine. More focus on weight placement. Like GregB said there hasn't been a ton of changes to bikes.. true in some ways if you're looking from a far view but if you're in it like you guys are with sleds they do improve constantly and most of the improvement comes from the frame design. The way they build flex characteristics into it. That is higher level and I think there are benefits to be had there but I don't know if it will transfer to sleds. Sleds are different because 99% of buyers are not racers while with bikes it is almost the opposite. It is like anything else, you can slap a frame together pretty easy but then to make it 10% better requires a ton of effort, and then to get 5% better after that is even more effort, and then another 2% is even more, and so on. I don't know if they'll go down those roads but I know there are gains to be had there. It is interesting hearing cat talk about the use of different materials in different areas for different reasons, that is interesting to me that they're at least thinking about that stuff and could expand that thinking further. That is getting into a next level Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnstang Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 27 minutes ago, Not greg b said: I think the off trail thing is close to getting shut down as fast as the trails. I know the locals in up are getting sick of the jack asses riding every where but where they should be I don't see why the government would close public property to snowmobiles because of private property issues. That is basically just a snowmobile ban at that point. I don't think that will happen, there are many areas where that is how people travel around in winter and certain economies depend on snowmobile where the government won't do that. It's alot easier for a property owner to just deny access and possibly close down a trail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 34 minutes ago, mnstang said: Electric... But as far as the vehicle and chassis I'm not sure. I don't see drastic changes like how the Rev changed things but I think continued development focusing on better rider input and manipulation of the machine. More focus on weight placement. Like GregB said there hasn't been a ton of changes to bikes.. true in some ways if you're looking from a far view but if you're in it like you guys are with sleds they do improve constantly and most of the improvement comes from the frame design. The way they build flex characteristics into it. That is higher level and I think there are benefits to be had there but I don't know if it will transfer to sleds. Sleds are different because 99% of buyers are not racers while with bikes it is almost the opposite. It is like anything else, you can slap a frame together pretty easy but then to make it 10% better requires a ton of effort, and then to get 5% better after that is even more effort, and then another 2% is even more, and so on. I don't know if they'll go down those roads but I know there are gains to be had there. It is interesting hearing cat talk about the use of different materials in different areas for different reasons, that is interesting to me that they're at least thinking about that stuff and could expand that thinking further. That is getting into a next level material advancements are an excellent point... lighter and as durable is a good thing for everyone. ease of maintenance and repair is an area I'd like to see manufacturers head for everything with an engine. I've always said that engineers that work for XYZ corporation should be required to spend five years in the repair field before they are allowed to design and engineer anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not greg b Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 32 minutes ago, mnstang said: I don't see why the government would close public property to snowmobiles because of private property issues. That is basically just a snowmobile ban at that point. I don't think that will happen, there are many areas where that is how people travel around in winter and certain economies depend on snowmobile where the government won't do that. It's alot easier for a property owner to just deny access and possibly close down a trail. Look at what they have done out west. Wilderness areas. The government would love to have all of it like that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 54 minutes ago, Not greg b said: Look at what they have done out west. Wilderness areas. The government would love to have all of it like that I agree. Anything that makes sledders look bad is ammo for the green crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnstang Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 2 hours ago, Not greg b said: Look at what they have done out west. Wilderness areas. The government would love to have all of it like that I guess I'm not sure what they're doing out there. I hear alot of things about the BLM in hunting community that sounds pretty sucky. I know people still ride out west. I don't know, I'm not that worried about it. I don't see it happening in MN in my lifetime, it's too much apart of the culture. I think trails are in much more danger. Not only do you have to worry about landowner issues, but if the clubs lose their government $$ then trails close from that too. The government would pull trail funding long before they outright ban snowmobiles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sled_Hed Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 The only way clubs lose funding is if registration drops way off other than a few grants for equipment etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 4 hours ago, Not greg b said: I think that has peaked and they are shifting back towards the trail market as they have have ignored it for a while. 4 hours ago, Crnr2Crnr said: keep explaining... as there are areas where it can be done legally. Up here the off trail is still getting bigger. Mind you up here there is NO PRIVATE LAND near our trails, none. Its 85 miles by trail north to the next town, crown land every where in between sled where you want. Shit it's only 90 south to Crane Lake, no private land on our side. Power lines up here are fair game, first come first served, if ya got he balls as every little hump in the snow is a rock underneath. My younger son just stretched his 2017 146" 2.25" Assault to 155" 2.5" to head out west to BC for 2 weeks in January. Narrowed the front end this year to just waiting for the shortened shocks to return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 17, 2022 Author Share Posted December 17, 2022 2 minutes ago, HSR said: Up here the off trail is still getting bigger. Mind you up here there is NO PRIVATE LAND near our trails, none. Its 85 miles by trail north to the next town, crown land every where in between sled where you want. Shit it's only 90 south to Crane Lake, no private land on our side. Power lines up here are fair game, first come first served, if ya got he balls as every little hump in the snow is a rock underneath. My younger son just stretched his 2017 146" 2.25" Assault to 155" 2.5" to head out west to BC for 2 weeks in January. Narrowed the front end this year to just waiting for the shortened shocks to return. wHUt, Wisconsin, Minnesota and the Yoop aren't the epicenter of snowmobiling? hush child, men are talking here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 5 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: wHUt, Wisconsin, Minnesota and the Yoop aren't the epicenter of snowmobiling? hush child, men are talking here. You ever put 200 miles on nice groomed trails in a day and not meet one single sled all day?? If you REALLY want to sled paradise, PM me. I'll tell ya where to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 17, 2022 Author Share Posted December 17, 2022 4 minutes ago, HSR said: You ever put 200 miles on nice groomed trails in a day and not meet one single sled all day?? If you REALLY want to sled paradise, PM me. I'll tell ya where to go yes, I miss riding weekdays and making the wife be the sole source of income!!! if you are anywhere near you know who... hard no! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Crnr2Crnr said: yes, I miss riding weekdays and making the wife be the sole source of income!!! if you are anywhere near you know who... hard no! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crnr2Crnr Posted December 17, 2022 Author Share Posted December 17, 2022 2 minutes ago, HSR said: no, don't.... I was referring to Canada's biggest magatard... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 17, 2022 Share Posted December 17, 2022 2 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said: I was referring to Canada's biggest magatard... You're closer to me than that idiot is. If he came within 100 miles of here he'd stick oot like a sore thumb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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