The West’s largest coal-fired power plant is closing. Not even Trump can save it.

 

As a presidential candidate, Donald Trump promised to help revive the struggling coal industry.

It’s looking like a tough promise to keep.

In the past three weeks, owners of two of the nation’s biggest coal-fired power plants have announced plans to shut them down, potentially idling hundreds of workers. One plant in Arizona is the largest coal-fired facility in the western United States.

“[We’re] bringing back jobs, big league,” President Trump said Tuesday after signing legislation that would scrap requirements for natural resources companies to disclose payments to foreign governments. “We’re bringing them back at the plant level. We’re bringing them back at the mine level. The energy jobs are coming back.”

Yet even with his efforts to roll back Obama-era energy regulations, a lot of coal jobs won’t ever return, mainly because of harsh economic realities.

snip

rest at link

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2017/02/14/the-wests-largest-coal-fired-power-plant-is-closing-not-even-trump-can-save-it/?utm_term=.cf1bbf3c5740

 

Coal jobs are great for the middle class 

retarded regulations hurt everyone ......good regulations are fine. Obama put tons of retarded regulations in place.....Trump will remove plenty of good ones. The pendulum swings further and further to each side and as usual the common man gets straight fucked begging for the middle of the road

1 minute ago, f7ben said:

retarded regulations hurt everyone ......good regulations are fine. Obama put tons of retarded regulations in place.....Trump will remove plenty of good ones. The pendulum swings further and further to each side and as usual the common man gets straight fucked begging for the middle of the road

Huh?

The plants aren't closing due to regulations.  They're closing because natural gas is cheaper.

10 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

Huh?

The plants aren't closing due to regulations.  They're closing because natural gas is cheaper.

oh I know ....but they got hurt bad the last decade because of regulation and coal isnt only used in generation....its used a an input material for plenty of other industry. 

Coking coal will be around for a long time. 

Just now, ArcticCrusher said:

Coking coal will be around for a long time. 

no , it wont ......integrated steel mills are dying and will be gone within the next 15 years or so

5 minutes ago, f7ben said:

no , it wont ......integrated steel mills are dying and will be gone within the next 15 years or so

More the product shipped to other countries.   Thermo coal is on the decline globally.   Coking production levels are expected to hold.   Least that's what I've read. 

3 minutes ago, ArcticCrusher said:

More the product shipped to other countries.   Thermo coal is on the decline globally.   Coking production levels are expected to hold.   Least that's what I've read. 

I guess I was thinking more domestically .....I just cant see how even globallly anyone running blast furnaces will remain competitive......mini-mills have revolutionized the industry

44 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

Huh?

The plants aren't closing due to regulations.  They're closing because natural gas is cheaper.

ha how about those regulations banning exporting coal I wonder if lifting some of those  would help anyone  

Nothing produces as much energy btu wise then cool. Natrual gas isnt cheaper 

3 minutes ago, jtssrx said:

Nothing produces as much energy btu wise then cool. Natrual gas isnt cheaper 

You'd better let these idiots know they're making a big mistake.

1 minute ago, ICEMAN! said:

You'd better let these idiots know they're making a big mistake.

NG is cleaner and abundant ....its a great fuel. Coal is needed for a ton of stuff though and we should facilitate using it in the cleanest cheapest way possible

4 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

You'd better let these idiots know they're making a big mistake.

It was a big mistake here... Ontario’s hell-bent determination to phase out coal-fired generation raised electricity rates without significantly improving air pollution levels, a new Fraser Institute report says. Even though there was reliable information available at the time that showed Ontario coal was not a big player in common air pollution ingredients, the political agenda made it impossible to discuss less expensive options to full closure, he said.“They just demonized it up and down — made it impossible to even have the conversation,” added McKitrick. “They turned it into a really dirty word and that had the effect of shutting down the whole discussion even before it began which, of course, led to a lot of really bad decision making. The small and, in some cases, statistically insignificant improvements in air quality in a few locations could have been achieved more cheaply with pollution control devices like scrubbers, the report concluded. Residential wood-burning fireplaces, dust from unpaved roads and even meat cooking were bigger contributors to fine particulate emissions than coal-fired generation, according to the 2005 Environment Canada Air Pollution Emissions Inventory.

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/01/17/shutdown-of-coal-plants-raised-electricity-rates-failed-to-reduce-pollution-report

1 minute ago, f7ben said:

NG is cleaner and abundant ....its a great fuel. Coal is needed for a ton of stuff though and we should facilitate using it in the cleanest cheapest way possible

I am with u but all the people saying that start getting there panties in a knot when they use fracking to get that cheep clean energy that T.Boone marketed the fed so hard to change over to

4 minutes ago, f7ben said:

NG is cleaner and abundant ....its a great fuel. Coal is needed for a ton of stuff though and we should facilitate using it in the cleanest cheapest way possible

I don't disagree, but nobody should live under the illusion that coal is going to make any kind of a comeback.  It will continue to decline due to natural gas and renewables.

1 minute ago, 02sled said:

It was a big mistake here... Ontario’s hell-bent determination to phase out coal-fired generation raised electricity rates without significantly improving air pollution levels, a new Fraser Institute report says. Even though there was reliable information available at the time that showed Ontario coal was not a big player in common air pollution ingredients, the political agenda made it impossible to discuss less expensive options to full closure, he said.“They just demonized it up and down — made it impossible to even have the conversation,” added McKitrick. “They turned it into a really dirty word and that had the effect of shutting down the whole discussion even before it began which, of course, led to a lot of really bad decision making. The small and, in some cases, statistically insignificant improvements in air quality in a few locations could have been achieved more cheaply with pollution control devices like scrubbers, the report concluded. Residential wood-burning fireplaces, dust from unpaved roads and even meat cooking were bigger contributors to fine particulate emissions than coal-fired generation, according to the 2005 Environment Canada Air Pollution Emissions Inventory.

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/01/17/shutdown-of-coal-plants-raised-electricity-rates-failed-to-reduce-pollution-report

they were just mislead . Iceman knows what he is talking about he saw it on Huff post

3 minutes ago, 02sled said:

It was a big mistake here... Ontario’s hell-bent determination to phase out coal-fired generation raised electricity rates without significantly improving air pollution levels, a new Fraser Institute report says. Even though there was reliable information available at the time that showed Ontario coal was not a big player in common air pollution ingredients, the political agenda made it impossible to discuss less expensive options to full closure, he said.“They just demonized it up and down — made it impossible to even have the conversation,” added McKitrick. “They turned it into a really dirty word and that had the effect of shutting down the whole discussion even before it began which, of course, led to a lot of really bad decision making. The small and, in some cases, statistically insignificant improvements in air quality in a few locations could have been achieved more cheaply with pollution control devices like scrubbers, the report concluded. Residential wood-burning fireplaces, dust from unpaved roads and even meat cooking were bigger contributors to fine particulate emissions than coal-fired generation, according to the 2005 Environment Canada Air Pollution Emissions Inventory.

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/01/17/shutdown-of-coal-plants-raised-electricity-rates-failed-to-reduce-pollution-report

Ross McKitrick is a brain dead climate change denier.

Just now, ICEMAN! said:

I don't disagree, but nobody should live under the illusion that coal is going to make any kind of a comeback.  It will continue to decline due to natural gas and renewables.

again U keep talking NG . U know as well as I the left will get there way some day soon and totally ban fracking . what will that do to the cost of NG? now we will have all these converted plants and be bent over and fucked raw for power and heat . but hey it felt good to pretend we were saving the planet for a few yrs  

1 minute ago, ICEMAN! said:

Ross McKitrick is a brain dead climate change denier.

see I told u

7 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

I don't disagree, but nobody should live under the illusion that coal is going to make any kind of a comeback.  It will continue to decline due to natural gas and renewables.

absolutely ....but the market should dictate that ....not legislation based on fantasy

8 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

Ross McKitrick is a brain dead climate change denier.

Something tells me the Fraser Institute with no allegiance, financial or otherwise to anyone or political party has a whole lot of people a with a whole lot more intelligence than you. Ever hear of air scrubbers for the exhaust and read the reports on the before and after emissions. Something tells me you haven't.

It's no surprise you'll dismiss a Canadian based Fraser Institute report, just like you dismissed a Canadian CIBC Wood Gundy report and chose a US based report on retirement savings.

Keep your cherry picking selectivity going, only looking at what you can dig up that aligns with what you believe, even if it isn't applicable to Canada.  

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=667&t=3

So is icecrybaby saying the open market dictates better than government regs?

13 minutes ago, ICEMAN! said:

Ross McKitrick is a brain dead climate change denier.

Lol you know you're a faggot when you start using terms like climate change denier  

3 minutes ago, 02sled said:

Something tells me the Fraser Institute with no allegiance, financial or otherwise to anyone or political party has a whole lot of people a with a whole lot more intelligence than you. Ever hear of air scrubbers for the exhaust and read the reports on the before and after emissions. Something tells me you haven't.

It's no surprise you'll dismiss a Canadian based Fraser Institute report, just like you dismissed a Canadian CIBC Wood Gundy report and chose a US based report on retirement savings.

Keep your cherry picking selectivity going, only looking at what you can dig up that aligns with what you believe, even if it isn't applicable to Canada.  

The Fraser Institute is right wing conservative biased as is the Toronto Sun.