Comfirmed: obama lied, $400 million was ransom

[1jkw]

Fact is we were losing in Afghanistan, the number of troops was tripled and territory was taken and held and still is today, yes there is troubled spots and it is far from perfect, but there are now markets and schools where it once wasn't safe to even drive through.

There were over 500 American dead when Obama took office and there is less than 2400 total now.

The saber rattling really scared Iraq, Iran before didn't it?  Russia was real scared when it took Georgia and all we did is send back the 2000 troops who were helping us in Iraq.

France not with us in Iraq, remember freedom fries?

Did you ever think Iran maybe didn't like it when we overthrew their government in the 50's or continually try to manipulate their country? Russia has been their friend we have been their enemy, not all that hard to figure out, more flies with honey than with vinegar.

[Zambroski]

9 hours ago, 1jkw said:

Fact is we were losing in Afghanistan, the number of troops was tripled and territory was taken and held and still is today, yes there is troubled spots and it is far from perfect, but there are now markets and schools where it once wasn't safe to even drive through.

There were over 500 American dead when Obama took office and there is less than 2400 total now.

The saber rattling really scared Iraq, Iran before didn't it?  Russia was real scared when it took Georgia and all we did is send back the 2000 troops who were helping us in Iraq.

France not with us in Iraq, remember freedom fries?

Did you ever think Iran maybe didn't like it when we overthrew their government in the 50's or continually try to manipulate their country? Russia has been their friend we have been their enemy, not all that hard to figure out, more flies with honey than with vinegar.

Gonna try here....I missed your response earlier.  Not necessarily arguing, just debating a few facts and difference of opinion.  Gonna try and go your paragraphs in order to my responses.  

Well, it's all sorta relative but if you ask yourself what can we win there?  The answer is almost nothing.  All we've done is strengthen relations between Afghanistan and Pakistan.  Both harbor terrorist operations for the same purpose.  Which has now had a very successful little off-shoot called ISIS.  We are just a temporary occupying force there.  And while we are successful on a "kill ratio" level, and we do hold land territories, it's all temporary and will revert back to what it was and how it was within months of our exit.  Again...gain is almost zero.  If you ask any Spec ops dude what he think they are accomplishing....that is gonna be the answer....ZERO.  But they get some cool-ass "hose em" missions.  

Actually, I believe the numbers are 500 dead under Bush and 2500 under Obama (not 100% though).  I used to know the wounded which is staggering.  Obama decreasing the number size in Afghanistan then declaring "we're done" in 2014 while keeping some 10,000 more troops there is painfully inadequate..and leaves our forces unbelievable vulnerable in a really bad place as Obama's idiotic admin has been informed multiple times by the top generals....but to no avail.  Shame.  But women can fight now and transexuals are free to frolic in the fox holes.  Our military love this guy!

And actually yes, while we got to hear the Iraqi rhetoric over here in the US about "how tough they are", they really never thought we'd do anything more than talk.  EVER.  And in the first war, Sadam was betting and counting on a negotiation with him hoping to take some of the prize. The second showing sent them scattering like rats.  Yes...they really wanted nothing to do with it at all....Bush JR was going to kill a lot of them...and they knew it.  The WMD fiasco was just a smoke screen for us and a very poor one at that.  But, it got the job done......er sorta.  Well, it got Bush what he wanted anyway.  Again...our gain?  Almost Zero.

France is our SUPER ALLY now that they are a massive target for extremism.  No real surprise there.  And talk about two milk-toast administrations "bonding" to make well, a bigger milk toast sandwich.  France should buddy up to Russia instead.

Iran isn't holding any more of a grudge against us than the rest of those pricks.  And they all hate Russia too.  In fact, Russia's economic and political exchanges with Iran over the last two decades have been very much downhill. Shit...ours have been better with Iran.  Remember, the Russians are the other "infidels" in their backyard with the power to wipe them out...and threatens them more than we do.  Iranian leaders, like most, have almost no respect for Obama and HATE Kerry (and Clinton too...but they disregard women as nothing anyway...that should work well for us should she become the next Pres ).  The little "ransom" incident and letting Russia run missions from their basses against ISIS is all part of the "nose thumbing (or shoe showing)" toward Obama.

The American people need to understand that these nations of the Islamic faith do not think or feel anything like us.  They do not see our efforts to negotiate peacefully as a sign of "honor" or strength.  They respect power and force...PERIOD.  And while their negotiators and statesmen play our game with us, make no bones about it, their agenda stays intact the whole way....unless of course that agenda meets with a real threat (death), that could hinder it in the future.  But really, even death just sets them back...the "agenda" stays intact and stays fluid.

 

Edited August 20, 2016 by Zambroski

[1jkw]

1 hour ago, Zambroski said:

Gonna try here....I missed your response earlier.  Not necessarily arguing, just debating a few facts and difference of opinion.  Gonna try and go your paragraphs in order to my responses.  

Well, it's all sorta relative but if you ask yourself what can we win there?  The answer is almost nothing.  All we've done is strengthen relations between Afghanistan and Pakistan.  Both harbor terrorist operations for the same purpose.  Which has now had a very successful little off-shoot called ISIS.  We are just a temporary occupying force there.  And while we are successful on a "kill ratio" level, and we do hold land territories, it's all temporary and will revert back to what it was and how it was within months of our exit.  Again...gain is almost zero.  If you ask any Spec ops dude what he think they are accomplishing....that is gonna be the answer....ZERO.  But they get some cool-ass "hose em" missions.  

Actually, I believe the numbers are 500 dead under Bush and 2500 under Obama (not 100% though).  I used to know the wounded which is staggering.  Obama decreasing the number size in Afghanistan then declaring "we're done" in 2014 while keeping some 10,000 more troops there is painfully inadequate..and leaves our forces unbelievable vulnerable in a really bad place as Obama's idiotic admin has been informed multiple times by the top generals....but to no avail.  Shame.  But women can fight now and transexuals are free to frolic in the fox holes.  Our military love this guy!

And actually yes, while we got to hear the Iraqi rhetoric over here in the US about "how tough they are", they really never thought we'd do anything more than talk.  EVER.  And in the first war, Sadam was betting and counting on a negotiation with him hoping to take some of the prize. The second showing sent them scattering like rats.  Yes...they really wanted nothing to do with it at all....Bush JR was going to kill a lot of them...and they knew it.  The WMD fiasco was just a smoke screen for us and a very poor one at that.  But, it got the job done......er sorta.  Well, it got Bush what he wanted anyway.  Again...our gain?  Almost Zero.

France is our SUPER ALLY now that they are a massive target for extremism.  No real surprise there.  And talk about two milk-toast administrations "bonding" to make well, a bigger milk toast sandwich.  France should buddy up to Russia instead.

Iran isn't holding any more of a grudge against us than the rest of those pricks.  And they all hate Russia too.  In fact, Russia's economic and political exchanges with Iran over the last two decades have been very much downhill. Shit...ours have been better with Iran.  Remember, the Russians are the other "infidels" in their backyard with the power to wipe them out...and threatens them more than we do.  Iranian leaders, like most, have almost no respect for Obama and HATE Kerry (and Clinton too...but they disregard women as nothing anyway...that should work well for us should she become the next Pres ).  The little "ransom" incident and letting Russia run missions from their basses against ISIS is all part of the "nose thumbing (or shoe showing)" toward Obama.

The American people need to understand that these nations of the Islamic faith do not think or feel anything like us.  They do not see our efforts to negotiate peacefully as a sign of "honor" or strength.  They respect power and force...PERIOD.  And while their negotiators and statesmen play our game with us, make no bones about it, their agenda stays intact the whole way....unless of course that agenda meets with a real threat (death), that could hinder it in the future.  But really, even death just sets them back...the "agenda" stays intact and stays fluid.

 

So lets start at the top, both wars Iraq and Afghanistan were started by W not O, the 2500 is the total under O that included 593 in Iraq, 575 for W in Afg. for a total of 2383.

US deaths in (AFG. 2014, 55) (2015 22) ( 2016 5) The danger is for sure there for our troops, but look at the numbers they have gone down every year.  And the number of trained AFG. forces increases constantly.

I have a friend I have known  all my life, he was in AFG. for years  before 911 and has been back many times he maybe there now, he is a die hard Republican, and has said that there is great improvement in some areas there still some bad areas but overall better.  I have a relative who does security there and has for a few years he states the same thing.

France and Germany both opposed the Iraq war and many more ME countries are helping us now than during W's time for their own selfish reasons just like us.

I agree and disagree with your last paragraph, they don't see things like we do for sure, but they don't fear or respect power or force they strap on vests and blow themselves up against the force and strength.

As far as strength goes the US has taken on terrorists in more countries under O than at any other time, and obl dead Maliki who had his way with W gone, Gaddafi who survived Reagan, Bush1, Clinton, Bush 2, gone.

[Zambroski]

Ehhhh....I'll agree to disagree on the stuff we agree to disagree on.  And I'm losing interest anyway.

However,  Obama's admin has taken on more terrorists because he's had to for a reason.  And they DO FEAR power and force.  I've trained some of these ragheads and their battle instincts and courage in the face of death is almost non-existent.  When faced with an overwhelming force or certain death, they scatter.  The suicide bombings are not a sign of aggression or opposition to force or strength......it's a desperate measure in the name of religion to try and instill fear in their enemy.  And almost always the one strapping it on drew the short straw and their family is compensated.