Tommcat

3 more shot here last night, 2 dead. zero AR's involved, zero lawful gun owners.

3 others arrested for illegal possesion after a car jacking, 2 were already out on bail for previous carjacking.

it would almost seem like legal gun owners arent the problem, and criminals dont care about the gun laws.....weird

1 minute ago, HSR said:

Yeah ok if you think the US rates the same as those South American countries in terms of standards of living or laws you're reaching pretty hard. Not many people claim Brazil is one of the greatest free countries in the world or any of the others that are worse than you guys. For a country that is the self claimed leaders of the free world it doesn't look good. Almost the entire world is better than you guys. That link is not helping your argument at all.

I dont claim the US is one of the greatest countries anymore either, unfortunately. 

3 minutes ago, HSR said:

I'll check it out 

Its simply numbers, and people can form an opinion on those numbers.

Im just so sick of flat out lies and bullshit biased "facts" being thrown around.

If 2 people read some stats and form 2 different opinions, I'll respect both opinions. But people shouldn't be spoin fed false info to influence their opinions. Which unfortunately is what our media does now

Here's an example of where the right is at fault.

A current proposed law would require mandatory live fire training in order to get a concealed carry license.  Our 2a group opposes it.

Personally, i think the more training people get, the safer everyone is.

I've taken a lot of advanced training classes and have nevernot come out a better and more competent shooter.

So how is that a bad thing?

Just now, Steve753 said:

Maybe handguns are the problem.

Interestingly, European societies that come close to US rates of gun ownership, in terms of gun owners per 100 people, (but with hunting rifles and shotguns rather than handguns), such as Finland and Norway, are among the safest societies internationally with regards to gun violence

I wouldn't say any one gun is THE problem, but handguns are certainly used in the overwhelming majority of crimes.

And yet the politicians are focused on a gun platform used in about .5% of violent crime.

I dont get it

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country

Some interesting stats here, IFyou're interested in stats and not just repeating talking points

Here's a few examples of where politicians that are left sided are THE problem and not the solution.

This is only 2 of the currently proposed legislations currently here right now, and show the differencein thinking.

Pro 2a groups have proposed that if someone has a red flag law filed on them to seize their guns, mental health should be required and provided free of cost. The law should also apply to ANYONE suicidal or threatening, regardless of being a gun owner or not.

The democrats fully oppose this.

Anti 2a is proposing that anyone that has their guns stolen is prosecuted for whatever crimes are committed with those weapons.

43 minutes ago, HSR said:

Well then it sounds like a flaw in the system that needs to be addressed. It shows how easy criminals can get a gun.Can't just shrug your shoulders and so oh well.

You could actually put them in prison after their first, second or even third violent crime or firearm felony, that would certainly be a step in the right direction. 

2 hours ago, HSR said:

I already addressed Brazil, not really what I would call first world country.

C'mon Tom to try an excuse what is going on in your country by relying on statistics isn't right. Until all of you admit there is a problem nothing is going to change,in fact things are going to get far worse before they get better. The staus quo isn't cutting it and it affects my country too as the US is the #1 supplier of illegal handguns here.

Gun laws simply aren't the answer, and you're over simplifying things.

2 of the countries with the most relaxed gun laws in the world are norway and Finland, neither even cracks the top 100 in gun violence. 

Its a people problem, not a lack of laws.

Its already illegal to kill someone, how does making it more illegal help?

54 minutes ago, HSR said:

What about all the legal owners that don't properly store their weapons and get robbed? All guns start out as "legally" owned guns unless robbed from a gun store. Where do you think illegal handguns come from ,Santa?

Well other than these countries which I don't consider first world El Salvador; Venezuela; Guatemala; Colombia; Honduras; Brazil. 

Unless I'm missing some statistics the US leads the way in most categories. Especially school shootings.

You're definitely missing sime data.

If i remember from last year, the US was top 5 in total gun deaths, but around 35 in per 100k citizens. 

Brazil is usually about 4 times higher. 

The only category we were 1st in was suicides by firearm. 

Not really sure what to make of that stat.

29 minutes ago, HSR said:

The US has more shootings than any other civilized country in the entire world. Why?Is it the only country with mental health issues?Is it the only country with criminals?

not true, not even on total gun deaths and nowhere near close on deaths per capita, which i think is a more meaningful number

55 minutes ago, HSR said:

Sorry I totally disagree. That is something that is up to the parents and whether or not they want their kids handling firearms. School is the LAST place kids should be learning gun safety, they are there to learn other things.

i agree, but they also shouldnt be taught that guns are evil. the topic simply doesnt need to be brought up at all, and both sides could be happy.
i was initially introduced to guns in cub scouts, at a pretty early age. which is a totally different situation than a public school.

i do however think that kids SHOULD be introduced to guns, shooting and safety at an early age to help eliminate fear and or curiosity.

1 hour ago, Steve753 said:

Don't really see why a 10 year old needs to do this. Hunting is a different story. Pistols aren't used for hunting though. To each his own I guess.

that's like saying AR's arent used for hunting, it's simply not true.

3 minutes ago, Steve753 said:

Huh, I've traveled to some of the most hostile countries in the world and never felt unsafe or the need to carry. To each his own I guess. 

Thats a concept i wish more could agree on.

4 minutes ago, Steve753 said:

Maybe you should move to a better area if you're afraid enough that you feel the need to carry all the time.

Well, for one, not everyone can afford to pack up and move their home and business. 

Second, if you think you can pick a town where crime doesn't happen, you truly have a gift.

1 hour ago, Steve753 said:

Probably, but it always seems like those pesky people are the ones with the guns.

Not true. I dont know what the numbers would be but I'd love to see how many guns per day ARE NOT used in a crime, compared to those that are.

I carry 365 days a year, none of mine have randomly jumped up and shot any innocent people. 

1 hour ago, Steve753 said:

Huh. So if there wasn't a gun it wouldn't have happened you're saying?

Well, i guess if you could uninvent firearms, explosives and black powder, then no it would definitely not have happened with a gun.

Would someone have still been killed this weekend by some other means? Yes, because bad people are bad people, regardless of what they use.

4 hours ago, Steve753 said:

Why didn't they use a knife?

Well, they're not overly effective in a drive by

another shooting/murder here last night. zero AR's used, zero lawful gun owners, or US citizens either

On 6/20/2023 at 1:10 PM, HSR said:

So is there zero need for people to own guns then? If only the irresponsible are using them?

Should be a statistic somewhere that shows how many times guns were legally used in self defense.

there is, but the media doesnt want you to see it

accurate stats are pretty much impossible to come up with, since a large number of defensive use goes unreported, since people dont want to get in trouble in our current anti gun culture.

also, define "defensive use". does that mean just drawing it, firing it as a warning, shooting someone, or actually killing someone. everyone seems to change the definition to suit their current needs, like everything these days.

estimates are anywhere from 50k per year, to several million a year.

13 minutes ago, Sleepr2 said:

I had 30 18m and 4 R2 Hand helds , just sold the last of my Pyromate stuff last week👍

still have one 12 ft enclosed trailer and a bunch of racks of guns to sell and I’m done😊

I sure dont miss pyromate

Last night

https://fb.watch/l5ZRUZyQoB/?mibextid=Nif5oz

3 more shootings in my city this weekend, including the police being shot at.

No ARs or legal gun owners involved.

25 minutes ago, hayward said:

They should have given these guys an award for it not a penalty.

But they were involved in "a scheme to increase fuel mileage", what were they thinking!?

we start our season this saturday, get a week off and then the insanity starts. plus it looks like i got the gig to shoot for Six Flags every friday night this summer