If you can't handle your machine...

[Crnr2Crnr]

or manage to stay on your side of the F'NG trail or corner... Then slow down, don't drink and ride or just STAY HOME ffs.  

EDIT... FFS!!! 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/607937096061503/permalink/2100476800140851/?sfnsn=mo&ref=share&mibextid=KtfwRi

 

https://wausaupilotandreview.com/2023/02/02/just-in-second-snowmobile-crash-reported-thursday-with-2-injured/

Absolutely 🤢 of reading this completely avoidable shit... 😡

Edited February 28, 2023 by Crnr2Crnr

[Crnr2Crnr]

0.239 right on top the list, really?  wee bit more than 0.08 don't you think?  well, not anymore he doesn't. 

https://widnr.widen.net/s/5rrftcp9b7/snow2023 

 

[800renegaderider]

11 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

0.239 right on top the list, really?  wee bit more than 0.08 don't you think?  well, not anymore he doesn't. 

https://widnr.widen.net/s/5rrftcp9b7/snow2023 

 

I never understood the stop at every intersection and pound a beer till you’re shit faced crew. How is that fun and enjoyable? I spend a ton of money to ride not go a mile stop for 20mins to drink and piss….fuck that I can sit on my couch and do that save a bunch of money. 

[Crnr2Crnr]

3 minutes ago, 800renegaderider said:

I never understood the stop at every intersection and pound a beer till you’re shit faced crew. How is that fun and enjoyable? I spend a ton of money to ride not go a mile stop for 20mins to drink and piss….fuck that I can sit on my couch and do that save a bunch of money. 

amazing... and frustrating. 

hey c2c, why don't you come up north and go riding... here's why 

https://dnr.wisconsin.gov/topic/snowmobile/CrashInfo

too many incompetents out there.

I drink and get crazy on the internet...

Edited February 2, 2023 by Crnr2Crnr

[snoughnut]

1 hour ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

or manage to stay on your side of the F'NG trail or corner... Then slow down, don't drink and ride or just STAY HOME ffs.  

https://wausaupilotandreview.com/2023/02/02/just-in-second-snowmobile-crash-reported-thursday-with-2-injured/

Absolutely 🤢 of reading this completely avoidable shit... 😡

Dude, don't get too excited over it, this shit has been happening forever. As a matter of fact it was far worse back in the 90's and early 2000's (20 - 30 or more deaths per year back then) and yes I know there were more sleds back then also. One thing that stands out to me when you read those DNR reports especially from last year and this year is just about every person on there is 40+ years of age. 

[Jerry 976]

Bottom right corner of the display.

 

 

[Ez ryder]

1 hour ago, snoughnut said:

Dude, don't get too excited over it, this shit has been happening forever. As a matter of fact it was far worse back in the 90's and early 2000's (20 - 30 or more deaths per year back then) and yes I know there were more sleds back then also. One thing that stands out to me when you read those DNR reports especially from last year and this year is just about every person on there is 40+ years of age. 

Agree it was way worse in the 90s than today . I am not sure l knew any one who was not drinking to excess and going out hitting the trail back then . Me included .

Alot less wrecks were reported back then also . Unless some one was really hurt ie helicopter needed no one wanted cops or dnr involved . 

[Crnr2Crnr]

5 hours ago, snoughnut said:

Dude, don't get too excited over it, this shit has been happening forever. As a matter of fact it was far worse back in the 90's and early 2000's (20 - 30 or more deaths per year back then) and yes I know there were more sleds back then also. One thing that stands out to me when you read those DNR reports especially from last year and this year is just about every person on there is 40+ years of age. 

Ikr, it troubles me a bit as my baby brother is driving from RI home right now to ride for a week and thank goodness we'll be able to ride local in central Wisconsin to completely avoid the shit show 59 minutes from home.  My concern unfounded or not is getting him home to his family and me to mine.  Unlikely or selfish, if I see someone coming directly at me on the wrong side of the trail I'll likely jump off my sled and then beat their battered body into the ground. 

Too harsh?  

 No, just maybe not harsh enough... 78 & 43... why?

https://www.wsaw.com/2023/02/02/2-killed-vilas-county-snowmobile-crash/

4 hours ago, Jerry 976 said:

Bottom right corner of the display.

 

 

you've posted this countless times Jerry and as very much as I deeply appreciate it, I wonder how many people ride right past and never give it a second glance?

I've faced death directly in the face a few times... maybe that makes me hypersensitive to the reality of it and take such a defensive tone about the subject.

Sigh... stay right or stay off the fucking trails.  

Edited February 3, 2023 by Crnr2Crnr

[snoughnut]

1 hour ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

Ikr, it troubles me a bit as my baby brother is driving from RI home right now to ride for a week and thank goodness we'll be able to ride local in central Wisconsin to completely avoid the shit show 59 minutes from home.  My concern unfounded or not is getting him home to his family and me to mine.  Unlikely or selfish, if I see someone coming directly at me on the wrong side of the trail I'll likely jump off my sled and then beat their battered body into the ground. 

Too harsh?  

 No, just maybe not harsh enough... 78 & 43... why?

https://www.wsaw.com/2023/02/02/2-killed-vilas-county-snowmobile-crash/

you've posted this countless times Jerry and as very much as I deeply appreciate it, I wonder how many people ride right past and never give it a second glance?

I've faced death directly in the face a few times... maybe that makes me hypersensitive to the reality of it and take such a defensive tone about the subject.

Sigh... stay right or stay off the fucking trails.  

I’ll be curious to see what caused the crash between the 43 and 78 yr. old. It doesn’t appear to be alcohol related because it was before noon. All we can do as sledders is be defensive riders, there’s always going to idiots on the trails unfortunately.

[p51mstg]

16 hours ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

0.239 right on top the list, really?  wee bit more than 0.08 don't you think?  well, not anymore he doesn't. 

https://widnr.widen.net/s/5rrftcp9b7/snow2023 

 

Famous pilot Bob Hoover is given credit for saying, “There are old pilots and bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots.”  He was not one to shy away from risk, he took his share and barely lived to talk about it a few times.  I think what he meant by “bold” was someone who didn’t understand the risk and took it anyway.  
 

The other thing about pilots is they tend to study accidents, especially fatal ones.  It’s not morbid curiosity, it’s a dedication to try to avoid the same fate (because we recognize that we’re all capable of being idiots when the opportunity arises).

That’s what I think of when I see that list of crashes…

1 - Drunk driving

2 - Struck another snowmobile that was stopping

3 - Went off a curve

4 - Hit by a motor vehicle

All avoidable, and all of us know how.  Did they know how?  Probably.

There is no way to avoid all risk, and we shouldn’t try.  What all snowmobilers need to do is be aware of and manage the risk.  We not only need to help riders who don’t understand the risks, but also promote safer behavior to those who do.

[Jerry 976]

10 hours ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

Ikr, it troubles me a bit as my baby brother is driving from RI home right now to ride for a week and thank goodness we'll be able to ride local in central Wisconsin to completely avoid the shit show 59 minutes from home.  My concern unfounded or not is getting him home to his family and me to mine.  Unlikely or selfish, if I see someone coming directly at me on the wrong side of the trail I'll likely jump off my sled and then beat their battered body into the ground. 

Too harsh?  

 No, just maybe not harsh enough... 78 & 43... why?

https://www.wsaw.com/2023/02/02/2-killed-vilas-county-snowmobile-crash/

you've posted this countless times Jerry and as very much as I deeply appreciate it, I wonder how many people ride right past and never give it a second glance?

I've faced death directly in the face a few times... maybe that makes me hypersensitive to the reality of it and take such a defensive tone about the subject.

Sigh... stay right or stay off the fucking trails.  

There use to be a billboard next to that display with accident reports posted on it for that years accidents up to that point of the season.  I've come a cross several accidents over the years and read about many of them on several sites..... Very sad some lost their life while out having fun for the day. Some areas people place a cross with the person name and date along the side of the trail.

Edited February 3, 2023 by Jerry 976

[mnstang]

Bottom line things aren't going to change and getting all mad about it and yelling to 8 people on the internet isn't going to help either.  Ride defensive, ride mid week, ride off trail, whatever you have to do.  Everybody here has had close calls I'm sure, I have plenty and I've also been hit head on and could have died if things were inches different or if my reaction was was .10 off or my decision making.  Big deal.  There's goons out there everywhere sitting on death machines waiting for you and that's not going to change.  You can take the risk or not.  If it bothers you too much I'd stay off the trail.   Think outside your bubble take some time to learn about off trail riding opportunities and have more fun.  Trail riding is fun but there's so much more to snowmobiling than pounding trails over and over.

I can tell you there's a big difference between a close call and the last one second of an imminent head on collision.

[Doug]

Reading more details about this particular accident from a person that was there.  One sled was a rental and on the far left hand side of the trail in a wide area.

"it was on a hill but truth is the trail was super wide where it happened. And the one person was actually just off the trail and the other was so far to the left it was crazy."

"I came up on this accident shortly after it happened. I can tell you one sled was rented. After doing CPR even though my experience told me it was not going to do any good I left feeling the same way."

I will say first hand that I have experienced and seen these rental riders put themselves and others in bad dangerous situations.  In 2018 had a guy on a rental fall off in a corner and hit me.  If I won't of raised my leg would have had a broken leg.  As it was got the ski, A-frame, plastic bumper and tunnel and it was the first time he rode a sled.  Seen groups of rentals stop side by side on the trail blocking the trail in multiple bad locations such as bottom of hills in corners.  Would they drive their vehicle up a hill in the LH lane??

 

Rental companies should be doing or be required to do a more thural safety training before they send some of these people out on the trail.  I cringe when I see a sled with a rental company or numbers on the windshield.  Here is blurb from one of the rental companies.  Others had less than this in their rental requirements.   

 

"Laws & Regulations - It is your responsibility to know and familiarize yourself with the Wisconsin snowmobile regulations. Before heading out onto the trails please remember to follow all safety regulations. Click HERE for a quick reference guide to the Wisconsin Snowmobile Laws."

Edited February 3, 2023 by Doug

[p51mstg]

36 minutes ago, Doug said:

Reading more details about this particular accident from a person that was there.  One sled was a rental and on the far left hand side of the trail in a wide area.

"it was on a hill but truth is the trail was super wide where it happened. And the one person was actually just off the trail and the other was so far to the left it was crazy."

"I came up on this accident shortly after it happened. I can tell you one sled was rented. After doing CPR even though my experience told me it was not going to do any good I left feeling the same way."

I will say first hand that I have experienced and seen these rental riders put themselves and others in bad dangerous situations.  In 2018 had a guy on a rental fall off in a corner and hit me.  If I won't of raised my leg would have had a broken leg.  As it was got the ski, A-frame, plastic bumper and tunnel and it was the first time he rode a sled.  Seen groups of rentals stop side by side on the trail blocking the trail in multiple bad locations such as bottom of hills in corners.  Would they drive their vehicle up a hill in the LH lane??

 

Rental companies should be doing or be required to do a more safety training before they send some of these people out on the trail.  I cringe when I see a sled with a rental company or numbers on the windshield.  Here is blurb from one of the rental companies.  Others had less than this in their rental requirements.   

 

"Laws & Regulations - It is your responsibility to know and familiarize yourself with the Wisconsin snowmobile regulations. Before heading out onto the trails please remember to follow all safety regulations. Click HERE for a quick reference guide to the Wisconsin Snowmobile Laws."

When I was out west a couple of weeks ago, we encountered a group of renters.  One had gotten stuck and Todd Tupper volunteered to get them out (took him less time than it took me to move his sled out of the way).  While he did that, the others chatted.  At least one had an open faced helmet, and none of them had what I would consider gear warm enough for a normal day of trail riding in MN.  They were basically lost and asked for directions. 

As we left them, I thought...  who let them go unescorted and unprepared like this?  Why weren't they with a guide?  Why didn't they have a map or general idea where they could go?  Who thought it was okay to let them go without appropriate gear?  I wondered if they'd get back alive, that's how out of place they looked.

I've never rented and don't know what is expected for renters or rental providers.  But, it seems like a bad idea to just let people go without some kind of verification or training or review of trail etiquette.  

Edited February 3, 2023 by p51mstg

[Crnr2Crnr]

I've seen the rental rider packs out there and frankly they're usually pretty sketchy on the skills and general common sense.  Last winter we were up in Harrison Hills which is one of my favorite places to ride, just about to leave the lunch stop and a pack of them rolls in all on new Doo's with the rental info on them.  Told my brother and my buddy we picked a perfect time to leave and start heading back.  This was at 2pm mind you and most of them seemed pretty well sauced.  Maybe the rental sleds should get breathalyzers installed as mandatory equipment. 

 

[800renegaderider]

13 hours ago, snoughnut said:

I’ll be curious to see what caused the crash between the 43 and 78 yr. old. It doesn’t appear to be alcohol related because it was before noon. All we can do as sledders is be defensive riders, there’s always going to idiots on the trails unfortunately.

If it’s not alcohol related there is only one other thing it could be with a 78 year old……mistake gas for brake 

[Crnr2Crnr]

On 2/2/2023 at 10:31 PM, snoughnut said:

I’ll be curious to see what caused the crash between the 43 and 78 yr. old. It doesn’t appear to be alcohol related because it was before noon. All we can do as sledders is be defensive riders, there’s always going to idiots on the trails unfortunately.

 

On 2/3/2023 at 11:40 AM, 800renegaderider said:

If it’s not alcohol related there is only one other thing it could be with a 78 year old……mistake gas for brake 

 

wrong side of the trail, BAC still pending... my synopsis - utter incompetence 

Operator one on a rental snowmobile traveling westbound on a public trail failed to keep right as he was traveling uphill on a gradual curve. Operator one struck operator two, who was eastbound, resulting in ejection of both operators from their snowmobiles. Speed appears to be a factor. Investigation pending.

[snoughnut]

48 minutes ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

 

 

wrong side of the trail, BAC still pending... my synopsis - utter incompetence 

Operator one on a rental snowmobile traveling westbound on a public trail failed to keep right as he was traveling uphill on a gradual curve. Operator one struck operator two, who was eastbound, resulting in ejection of both operators from their snowmobiles. Speed appears to be a factor. Investigation pending.

I read that quite awhile ago but thanks anyway.  The 78 year old's family will be lawyering up on that one.

[800renegaderider]

13 hours ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

 

 

wrong side of the trail, BAC still pending... my synopsis - utter incompetence 

Operator one on a rental snowmobile traveling westbound on a public trail failed to keep right as he was traveling uphill on a gradual curve. Operator one struck operator two, who was eastbound, resulting in ejection of both operators from their snowmobiles. Speed appears to be a factor. Investigation pending.

Ah yes the old rental accident. There has been a few rental accidents in NH including a head on that I recall. It’s strange that states like VT require a 8hr safety courses to register for those born after 83 but if you’re renting a snowmobile and have zero experience ya screw it hop on and go for it. 

[Crnr2Crnr]

https://www.facebook.com/groups/607937096061503/permalink/2100476800140851/?sfnsn=mo&ref=share&mibextid=KtfwRi 

If you don't see this as a problem you may be part of the problem.  😡

[800renegaderider]

1 hour ago, Crnr2Crnr said:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/607937096061503/permalink/2100476800140851/?sfnsn=mo&ref=share&mibextid=KtfwRi 

If you don't see this as a problem you may be part of the problem.  😡

Damn the cat rider had no control at all was on the complete other side of the trail in that turn.

[jdsky]

49 minutes ago, 800renegaderider said:

Damn the cat rider had no control at all was on the complete other side of the trail in that turn.

But all you read about in sledding forums is how they corner on rails.  Derby weekend was a complete fucking shitshow with dipshits riding too fast and on the wrong side of the trail.  My brother had someone run over a ski, my nephew was forced off the trail by dipshits on his side and an asswipe nearly slid into me coming around a corner too fast and on the wrong side.  Would have hit me head on if I was not able to come to a complete stop. 

[Mag6240]

I tell everyone who rides with me for the first time, and remind those who don’t always ride with me:

Ride to stay on the trail, not to keep up!

That means stay RIGHT, and don’t worry about falling back some, I’ll be there at the next intersection if not the next road crossing.

I’ve followed some of these same guys just so I can ask them what they are thinking when they slide out into the wrong side, and most of the time they are not thinking…

[800renegaderider]

9 minutes ago, jdsky said:

But all you read about in sledding forums is how they corner on rails.  Derby weekend was a complete fucking shitshow with dipshits riding too fast and on the wrong side of the trail.  My brother had someone run over a ski, my nephew was forced off the trail by dipshits on his side and an asswipe nearly slid into me coming around a corner too fast and on the wrong side.  Would have hit me head on if I was not able to come to a complete stop. 

Probably just couldn’t turn all that weight .  I lead a lot in our group and it always amazes me the shocked reaction you get when meeting someone coming the other way slamming brakes or quick jolt turn back to the far right and you know it’s cause they are staring at their ski tips and not scanning ahead to see what’s coming. That didn’t look hilly or heavily wooded pines in that video I’m sure had they been looking they would have noticed through the trees other riders coming 🤷‍♂️.

[Crnr2Crnr]

18 minutes ago, jdsky said:

But all you read about in sledding forums is how they corner on rails.  Derby weekend was a complete fucking shitshow with dipshits riding too fast and on the wrong side of the trail.  My brother had someone run over a ski, my nephew was forced off the trail by dipshits on his side and an asswipe nearly slid into me coming around a corner too fast and on the wrong side.  Would have hit me head on if I was not able to come to a complete stop. 

this and incidents like this are why I absolutely refuse to ride 'up north' and around here generally lead.  10-12' wide trail and most of the tracks are right down the middle.  inexperienced riders are just as bad as experienced racer wanna be's.  the hand signals have also gotten out of hand.  on Sunday in the middle of a f'ng cornfield I had a group of four swerving and weaving trying to do hand signals and I could see the entire f'ng group.  keep your f'ng hands on the gdamn bars and your machine in control please.  sadly there's no IQ requirements to participate in this sport.