Snowbikes are the future

[Ez ryder]

22 hours ago, fortune46x said:

The snowbike thing is a odd duck. Most states define what a snowmobile is based off brakes, ski count etc. I know here in Iowa the DNR leaves it up to the clubs that put the trails together and most say no.

Why would Any one even ride one in Iowa? They suck ass on a trail . My guess is if you own one in Iowa you spend some real time driving west every yr 

[AK440]

5 hours ago, Ez ryder said:

Why would Any one even ride one in Iowa? They suck ass on a trail . My guess is if you own one in Iowa you spend some real time driving west every yr 

Judging from the videos I see on YouTube, there are plenty of retards in Iowa and other pancake flat Midwestern states that ride 3” paddle 163” 800+ mountain sleds in cornfields with a dusting of snow. Since these dipshits buy what they see in videos on social media, I’m confident a factory build snowbike will sell. Hell, have the bike come with a backpack with a shovel and these same people will be all over them. 
 

As far as cost, I suspect most snowbike guys already own their dirt bike so it’s not as expensive as you made it out to be in your other post. Plus they can ride that same bike in the other three seasons. 
 

I agree that the converted dirt bikes suck on packed trails. That’s no surprise, look at how they are laid out. An actual purpose build snowbike would be much more controllable and balanced. Ever seen a sled converted over for summer use with tires on the front? Sure, they go down a trail but suck ass for everything except climbing straight up  steep sand dunes. 
 

I firmly believe there is a market for this type of vehicle. Hopefully Cat has the balls to produce their factory built snowbike. I’d be first in line at the dealer ordering one in the spring.

[Ez ryder]

1 hour ago, AK440 said:

Judging from the videos I see on YouTube, there are plenty of retards in Iowa and other pancake flat Midwestern states that ride 3” paddle 163” 800+ mountain sleds in cornfields with a dusting of snow. Since these dipshits buy what they see in videos on social media, I’m confident a factory build snowbike will sell. Hell, have the bike come with a backpack with a shovel and these same people will be all over them. 
 

As far as cost, I suspect most snowbike guys already own their dirt bike so it’s not as expensive as you made it out to be in your other post. Plus they can ride that same bike in the other three seasons. 
 

I agree that the converted dirt bikes suck on packed trails. That’s no surprise, look at how they are laid out. An actual purpose build snowbike would be much more controllable and balanced. Ever seen a sled converted over for summer use with tires on the front? Sure, they go down a trail but suck ass for everything except climbing straight up  steep sand dunes. 
 

I firmly believe there is a market for this type of vehicle. Hopefully Cat has the balls to produce their factory built snowbike. I’d be first in line at the dealer ordering one in the spring.

So I take it you have never spent t8ne on a hard pack trail or attempted to cross a snow less street on a snowbike .

Also I know no one who dose not buy a new bike with there kit . Just the way it is . And after mods you NEVER convert back to dirt . Then there is the short time between rebuilds makes a mountian sled look like a Ling life between top ends .

Like I said they are great and have there place but every one I know also has a sled 2 completly diff rides . 

You are in for a solid 16k for a properly set up snobike if you do your own work 

If you are paying someone I don't even know because it is days after work in the shop prepping .

I would live to see a factory bike so you could have a warrenty but it is not going to happen . I have talked with guys well in the know who work for a company who is fully suited for such a venture and it is a non starter for a multitude of reasons 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Ez ryder

[racinfarmer]

On 11/12/2022 at 5:30 PM, krom said:

That's true for the kits added to an existing bike, but AC met all snowmobile requirements in the US and Canada for the sherco version, and the never to be produced patented one  (that was ready to go when textron bought ac)to be registered as a snowmobile. Including having the brake mounted to the left hand bar.

IMHO if they released them back when they hype was building, they would have sold more of them than they have of the blast.
 

They offered them through the race program one year.  It was a mid-season letter sent out to us.  I don't know anyone who took one up on the offer.

4 hours ago, AK440 said:

Judging from the videos I see on YouTube, there are plenty of retards in Iowa and other pancake flat Midwestern states that ride 3” paddle 163” 800+ mountain sleds in cornfields with a dusting of snow. Since these dipshits buy what they see in videos on social media, I’m confident a factory build snowbike will sell. Hell, have the bike come with a backpack with a shovel and these same people will be all over them. 
 

As far as cost, I suspect most snowbike guys already own their dirt bike so it’s not as expensive as you made it out to be in your other post. Plus they can ride that same bike in the other three seasons. 
 

I agree that the converted dirt bikes suck on packed trails. That’s no surprise, look at how they are laid out. An actual purpose build snowbike would be much more controllable and balanced. Ever seen a sled converted over for summer use with tires on the front? Sure, they go down a trail but suck ass for everything except climbing straight up  steep sand dunes. 
 

I firmly believe there is a market for this type of vehicle. Hopefully Cat has the balls to produce their factory built snowbike. I’d be first in line at the dealer ordering one in the spring.

All the locals here that have bikes with the sled kit are all on dedicated bikes.  I doubt many people convert them back and forth. 

[AK440]

5 hours ago, Ez ryder said:

So I take it you have never spent t8ne on a hard pack trail or attempted to cross a snow less street on a snowbike .

Also I know no one who dose not buy a new bike with there kit . Just the way it is . And after mods you NEVER convert back to dirt . Then there is the short time between rebuilds makes a mountian sled look like a Ling life between top ends .

Like I said they are great and have there place but every one I know also has a sled 2 completly diff rides . 

You are in for a solid 16k for a properly set up snobike if you do your own work 

If you are paying someone I don't even know because it is days after work in the shop prepping .

I would live to see a factory bike so you could have a warrenty but it is not going to happen . I have talked with guys well in the know who work for a company who is fully suited for such a venture and it is a non starter for a multitude of reasons 

I’ve ridden a snowbike across a paved road to connect a trail and yeah, it’s a bit sketchy and more difficult than a regular sled but for what snowbikes are used for whys that a deal breaker? The sled manufacturers already offer different types of sleds for different purposes, what’s so wrong with offering a production snowbike? They’d serve a niche of riding just like two up touring sleds, utility sleds and mountain sleds all serve their niches. 
 

A 400cc single like what Cat has would be very reliable and long lived in a light weight snowbike application. It doesn’t surprise me that some dipshits are having shortened life expectancy issues with the 450’s in motocross bikes. They were never designed to be held at high rpm for many minutes at a time when climbing tall, steep mountainsides. They don’t have the oil capacity for that type of use. The fact that the snowbike market continues to grow shows it’s a legitimate segment and deserves more attention. 

[Ez ryder]

9 hours ago, AK440 said:

I’ve ridden a snowbike across a paved road to connect a trail and yeah, it’s a bit sketchy and more difficult than a regular sled but for what snowbikes are used for whys that a deal breaker? The sled manufacturers already offer different types of sleds for different purposes, what’s so wrong with offering a production snowbike? They’d serve a niche of riding just like two up touring sleds, utility sleds and mountain sleds all serve their niches. 
 

A 400cc single like what Cat has would be very reliable and long lived in a light weight snowbike application. It doesn’t surprise me that some dipshits are having shortened life expectancy issues with the 450’s in motocross bikes. They were never designed to be held at high rpm for many minutes at a time when climbing tall, steep mountainsides. They don’t have the oil capacity for that type of use. The fact that the snowbike market continues to grow shows it’s a legitimate segment and deserves more attention. 

Like I said 1 oem was poind to do it and pulled the plug . Another owns a company hence all the tooling and patent and leases they also own a motorcycle division have a relashinship with KTM.  And offices full of  people to look in to every aspect good and bad in bringing a product to market . And remember this company is not affrade to put out new shit. And they said fuck it not going to do it . 

Like I said would be nice if someone did but not going to happen in the near future 

[Ez ryder]

11 hours ago, racinfarmer said:

They offered them through the race program one year.  It was a mid-season letter sent out to us.  I don't know anyone who took one up on the offer.

All the locals here that have bikes with the sled kit are all on dedicated bikes.  I doubt many people convert them back and forth. 

AlmostvNo one converts back big enough pita to do it once . 

They are fun but it has to be the right snow henc why 90% of the guys with bikes have a sled 

I only know 2 guys with bikes that don't have sleds and they are old and really can't Handel sleds any more . They only ride few hrs a day .they enjoy hanging/camping  at the pass for the winter as much if not more than the bikes . 

[sleepybrew]

those high-strung 450s live a short life span if ridden on dirt. lugging it with a snow bike kit will flog the living shit out of it, and you will be spending some big money

[fortune46x]

On 11/13/2022 at 9:38 AM, Ez ryder said:

Why would Any one even ride one in Iowa? They suck ass on a trail . My guess is if you own one in Iowa you spend some real time driving west every yr 

Theres a huge moto scene here surprisingly. 

19 hours ago, AK440 said:

Judging from the videos I see on YouTube, there are plenty of retards in Iowa and other pancake flat Midwestern states that ride 3” paddle 163” 800+ mountain sleds in cornfields with a dusting of snow. Since these dipshits buy what they see in videos on social media, I’m confident a factory build snowbike will sell. Hell, have the bike come with a backpack with a shovel and these same people will be all over them. 
 

As far as cost, I suspect most snowbike guys already own their dirt bike so it’s not as expensive as you made it out to be in your other post. Plus they can ride that same bike in the other three seasons. 
 

I agree that the converted dirt bikes suck on packed trails. That’s no surprise, look at how they are laid out. An actual purpose build snowbike would be much more controllable and balanced. Ever seen a sled converted over for summer use with tires on the front? Sure, they go down a trail but suck ass for everything except climbing straight up  steep sand dunes. 
 

I firmly believe there is a market for this type of vehicle. Hopefully Cat has the balls to produce their factory built snowbike. I’d be first in line at the dealer ordering one in the spring.

the amount of mtn sleds that show up on a weekend for groomed trails floors me , why the hell would you want something that turns like the titanic... smh 

[Not greg b]

6 minutes ago, fortune46x said:

Theres a huge moto scene here surprisingly. 

the amount of mtn sleds that show up on a weekend for groomed trails floors me , why the hell would you want something that turns like the titanic... smh 

That crowd always say “learn how to ride” “they rail corners” 

[Ez ryder]

19 minutes ago, fortune46x said:

Theres a huge moto scene here surprisingly. 

the amount of mtn sleds that show up on a weekend for groomed trails floors me , why the hell would you want something that turns like the titanic... smh 

But a moto screen is not a snow bike screen. They don't ride the same they don't Handel the same . In fact if you attempted to ride on on a moto cross track you would see why they were such a fail in the sled sno x push .

Again not fighting saying I don't like them.  They are fun as hell in the right place . And that place is deep snow . Iowa is not usualy getting deep snow .

And side note I also have a summit and dose it rail like a 121 no nor dose my renagade . But if all I had for the local snowfall was the sled I bought to go out west I would run it . And have . I havecrun 1000s of mi of trail on mountian sleds over the yrs . But you have to remember most of the time not in Iowa the land of locked members gates but N MN UP N WI guys are on those trail running to pick off there next pothole or clear cut etc then on to the next they are not on the trail all day for the most part . That is just where you see them . 

 

[Ez ryder]

23 minutes ago, Not greg b said:

That crowd always say “learn how to ride” “they rail corners” 

They don't rail like a 121 but they also for the most part don't have sway bars so yeah if you acctauly drive them  you can keep up zero question . More work yep but it is what it is . 

[AK440]

On 11/14/2022 at 4:35 AM, Ez ryder said:

Like I said 1 oem was poind to do it and pulled the plug . Another owns a company hence all the tooling and patent and leases they also own a motorcycle division have a relashinship with KTM.  And offices full of  people to look in to every aspect good and bad in bringing a product to market . And remember this company is not affrade to put out new shit. And they said fuck it not going to do it . 

Like I said would be nice if someone did but not going to happen in the near future 

Cat’s snowbike concept was based on a factory converted Sherco dirt bike with Camso track kit. I can see why it never went into production. How many people are interested in buying half a dirt bike that can’t be converted back to summer use without scrounging up all the parts yourself? Camso ended up dropping that track kit as well around a year or two later. I seem to remember their being a safety related recall about them.

Who cares what Polaris does or doesn’t do? They’ve missed out on many market opportunities in the snow side of the market, 4-stroke sleds, bringing back a triple, paring their Indy line back by dropping the liquid cooled 600 & 800 and trying to force the market to embrace their stupid ass baler suspension design for over 10 years. They’ve been losing in market share year after year to Doo and have only themselves to blame. 
 

Cat’s patented design for a snowbike is very sound. I’m certain it’d already be available if Textron wasn’t holding the snow division back. The snowvehical  market is ready for something different. Something less expensive. Something that offers riders a different experience than the way overpriced sleds they are buying currently. Since mountain sleds lead sales nowadays, who cares if a snowbike doesn’t appeal to grey haired, groomed trail crowd. The thing is snowbikes would still sell because the same dumbasses that buy a 174” 850 to ride around in a corn field will also buy a snowbike. It’s all about marketing and who’s promoting things in video clips on the internet. 

 

Edited November 15, 2022 by AK440

[Tommcat]

my opinion, based off building a few, and having input from the riders is, they're really cool for off trail exploring, especially the tight woods. They suck on the trail though.

and as far as cost, to build one right, they're big money

[EvilBird]

I rode with one last year .....Yamaha 450 with the timbersled kit. 

The Dude was in the back of the pack covered in snow dust freezing his ass off  

I own a KTM 500 i thought about buying a timbersled for it but after seeing one in action no fucking thanks. 

[AK440]

11 hours ago, Tommcat said:

my opinion, based off building a few, and having input from the riders is, they're really cool for off trail exploring, especially the tight woods. They suck on the trail though.

and as far as cost, to build one right, they're big money

I just found this.

https://www.ruffiansnowbikes.com

Pretty simple looking machine that only weighs 200lbs!

 

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by AK440

[Crnr2Crnr]

9 hours ago, AK440 said:

I just found this.

https://www.ruffiansnowbikes.com

Pretty simple looking machine that only weighs 200lbs!

 

 

 

 

you should order it immediately and leave a full review...

[mnstang]

Here's why snow bikes won't replace a sled 

Most sledders are fat, old, and out of shape.  They like to talk like their sled handles "like a dirt bike" but have no idea what that means but prefer to live in that world of ignorance.

A typical 450 moto engine is way more high performance oriented than anything this industry is used to which will have unacceptable maintenance intervals for the boomers who dont ever want to be responsible for taking care of anything (see how they've fucked up this country for example).  And the boomers offspring are just as bad, see FB groups.

Snow bikes wouldn't work well on the trails for the guys to bar hop and try to forget their life choices.  This is key.

Just to stir this dumpster fire, electric snowmobiles are the future.

That little 250f snow bike like thing looks pretty cool I'd love to have one.  Little spendy though.  But I can already hear the fat boomers "but muh 850"!!

[krom]

4 hours ago, mnstang said:

Just to stir this dumpster fire, electric snowmobiles are the future.

That little 250f snow bike like thing looks pretty cool I'd love to have one.  Little spendy though.  But I can already hear the fat boomers "but muh 850"!!

NY has banned the sale of all gas powered vehicles by 2030, or 2035.  This ban includes sleds, ATV's and SXS's

Edited November 18, 2022 by krom

[mnstang]

I'd rather ride any $500 hoopty 121" on the trail than any long track powder sled.  I wouldn't even go if the day was going to be trail riding a mountain sled.  Dumb AF.  You'd think these broughams with the new mountain sleds could afford $500 but maybe they don't have the room in their shitty suburb sub development with their 2.5 car garage house in their shitty association neighborhood.  Because those are the clowns that ride a mountain sled on the trails.

IMHO....

[Crnr2Crnr]

1 hour ago, krom said:

NY has banned the sale of all gas powered vehicles by 2030, or 2035.  This ban includes sleds, ATV's and SXS's

Outboards?  

what year are you scheduled to retire?  if you want a job in Wisconsin I can probably get you hired in one phone call. no mop required

 

[AK440]

On 11/18/2022 at 3:14 AM, mnstang said:

Here's why snow bikes won't replace a sled 

Most sledders are fat, old, and out of shape.  They like to talk like their sled handles "like a dirt bike" but have no idea what that means but prefer to live in that world of ignorance.

A typical 450 moto engine is way more high performance oriented than anything this industry is used to which will have unacceptable maintenance intervals for the boomers who dont ever want to be responsible for taking care of anything (see how they've fucked up this country for example).  And the boomers offspring are just as bad, see FB groups.

Snow bikes wouldn't work well on the trails for the guys to bar hop and try to forget their life choices.  This is key.

Just to stir this dumpster fire, electric snowmobiles are the future.

That little 250f snow bike like thing looks pretty cool I'd love to have one.  Little spendy though.  But I can already hear the fat boomers "but muh 850"!!

There is no reason that a factory built snowbike could be a nice alternative or compliment to a sled. Most snowmobiles own more than one machine. Wouldn’t it make more sense to sell less expensive snowbikes to the Midwest group that rides out west than $15,000 mountain sleds? I have no idea how big of a group or how popular it is for the Midwest market to haul their machines all the way to the mountains but it must be pretty significant seeing as how mountain sleds dominate sled sales now. 
 

This group must have significant disposable income, so less expensive, more capable toys for mountain riding would be very appealing. As far a maintenance intervals, that’s why a purpose built snowbike is needed. A CVT equipped 400cc 2-stroke is going to be far more reliable and more powerful than a strung out 450 MX bike that was designed for summer use only dirt bike with a much lighter drivetrain.

 

If Cat was to release their snowbike I could see Polaris offering something the next season. BRP already has a concept snowbike that actually makes way more sense for the average rider.

https://sledmagazine.com/the-white-rabbit-concept/

 

 

[AK440]

[Ez ryder]

On 11/15/2022 at 9:04 PM, AK440 said:

I just found this.

https://www.ruffiansnowbikes.com

Pretty simple looking machine that only weighs 200lbs!

 

 

 

 

Lol

[Not greg b]

5 hours ago, AK440 said:

There is no reason that a factory built snowbike could be a nice alternative or compliment to a sled. Most snowmobiles own more than one machine. Wouldn’t it make more sense to sell less expensive snowbikes to the Midwest group that rides out west than $15,000 mountain sleds? I have no idea how big of a group or how popular it is for the Midwest market to haul their machines all the way to the mountains but it must be pretty significant seeing as how mountain sleds dominate sled sales now. 
 

This group must have significant disposable income, so less expensive, more capable toys for mountain riding would be very appealing. As far a maintenance intervals, that’s why a purpose built snowbike is needed. A CVT equipped 400cc 2-stroke is going to be far more reliable and more powerful than a strung out 450 MX bike that was designed for summer use only dirt bike with a much lighter drivetrain.

 

If Cat was to release their snowbike I could see Polaris offering something the next season. BRP already has a concept snowbike that actually makes way more sense for the average rider.

https://sledmagazine.com/the-white-rabbit-concept/

 

 

A factory snow bike will be in the 15k range easily. A snow bike would cost way more to produce than a snowmobile. Way more going on with them. A snowmobile is one big piece of stamped out aluminum, a simple skid frame, track and plastics they are done