Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 I will acknowledge noggin is kicking ssfb in the cunt pretty bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 6 minutes ago, SSFB said: Are we just going to go around in a circle on this? If you can't understand that a meager wage by our standards is still much of an improvement for these workers, then there's really no discussion that can be had. I totally understand how the wage is relative to our own, that's not at all the issue. What you're failing to see is that this exchange is not at all voluntary. Just because both sides appear to benefit in some fashion doesn't mean it isn't still exploitation. That's what I've been trying to say the last two pages, man. Shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 'Work or starve' is not a choice, it's a threat. That's why capitalism sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSFB Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 Just now, motonoggin said: 'Work or starve' is not a choice, it's a threat. That's why capitalism sucks. It's a rule of nature is what it is. You can either fulfill your own needs in whatever way you want or you can work and exchange money for those things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, motonoggin said: 'Work or starve' is not a choice, it's a threat. That's why capitalism sucks. dammit dude. capitalism itself does not suck. it's the exploitation of it that sucks. you don't need to kill the entire thing to fix it. what you need are rules, regulations, and enforcement of them. that seems like an easier solution than what you're trying to do. Edited May 19, 2017 by Snoslinger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Im4snow Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 14 minutes ago, SSFB said: Are we just going to go around in a circle on this? If you can't understand that a meager wage by our standards is still much of an improvement for these workers, then there's really no discussion that can be had. You new here? What did you expect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Just now, SSFB said: It's a rule of nature is what it is. You can either fulfill your own needs in whatever way you want or you can work and exchange money for those things. It's not a rule of nature, it's the law of the jungle. This isn't a fucking jungle, it's civilization. And one cannot just go off and fulfill their needs in whatever way they please, not with capitalists wielding government power all over the planet. They fucking own everything, dude. Your ONLY choice, if you want to survive under capitalism, is to submit to the system. This is not a voluntary action, but an act of self preservation. To believe that men are no better than apes posturing for position and power seems to be an awful dim view of humanity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 5 minutes ago, Snoslinger said: dammit dude. capitalism itself does not suck. it's the exploitation of it that sucks. you don't need to kill the entire thing to fix it. what you need are rules, regulations, and enforcement of them. that seems like an easier solution than what you're trying to do. Nope. To pretend it can be reformed is folly. We'll just end up right back where we started in 100 years or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 15 minutes ago, motonoggin said: I totally understand how the wage is relative to our own, that's not at all the issue. What you're failing to see is that this exchange is not at all voluntary. Just because both sides appear to benefit in some fashion doesn't mean it isn't still exploitation. That's what I've been trying to say the last two pages, man. Shit. Stop taking the softballs and address this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 1 minute ago, motonoggin said: Stop taking the softballs and address this. who are you asking? I happen to agree with your perspective on this exploitation topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Snoslinger said: who are you asking? I happen to agree with your perspective on this exploitation topic. Ssfb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Btw, you all should be paying me for all this emotional labor I'm performing debating this capitalist trap game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Highmark said: Its one thing to criticize its wholly another to want tear down the current system you and your employee's benefit from and even suggest killing those just like yourself. This is a black hole void of any logic. You need better versed in your theory so you don't have to resort to dumb shit like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSFB Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 16 minutes ago, motonoggin said: Stop taking the softballs and address this. I already did, I don't agree that it's exploitation. I don't see how giving someone alot better deal than they're currently getting in life can be qualified as exploitation. China has gone from a non-existent middle class to an exploding middle class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, SSFB said: I already did, I don't agree that it's exploitation. I don't see how giving someone alot better deal than they're currently getting in life can be qualified as exploitation. China has gone from a non-existent middle class to an exploding middle class. god damn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSFB Posted May 19, 2017 Author Share Posted May 19, 2017 1 minute ago, Snoslinger said: god damn Laugh all you want but you guys don't have anything to counter the way in which labor in these foreign countries has greatly improved the lives of those people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 so a US company getting electronics from a 3rd world country, where a worker gets a $1 a day, is not exploitation? because a European company was paying the guy $.90 a day before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 4 minutes ago, SSFB said: I already did, I don't agree that it's exploitation. I don't see how giving someone alot better deal than they're currently getting in life can be qualified as exploitation. China has gone from a non-existent middle class to an exploding middle class. You don't? Um, maybe because it isn't a voluntary exchange, but coercion through manipulation of prices and wages? Can the laborer name their wage? No Can the laborer survive without laboring? No It's fucking slavery with window dressing, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Just now, SSFB said: Laugh all you want but you guys don't have anything to counter the way in which labor in these foreign countries has greatly improved the lives of those people. well I guess being able to eat two piles of shit is a lot better than one pile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 1 minute ago, SSFB said: Laugh all you want but you guys don't have anything to counter the way in which labor in these foreign countries has greatly improved the lives of those people. African slaves ate better and had better living conditions in America than Africa. They received something in exchange for their labor - better conditions. What's the difference if the master fed and clothed them or paid them barely enough to feed and clothe themselves? None. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoslinger Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 how about the worker get better pay, and the people doing the exploration make less profit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motonoggin Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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